--- Log opened Tue May 08 00:00:12 2018
00:20 < Mead> In terms of the amount of ram the OS itself uses, does a 32bit x86 linux consume less system ram than a 64bit version of the same flavor of linux?
00:21 < edisonbulb> well 64 bit binaries will be larger
00:22 < edisonbulb> not sure the implications for ram usage though
00:23 < ][_R_][> Every pointer will be 8 bytes instead of 4 bytes, likewise if the programer choses to use intptr_t's.
00:23 < ][_R_][> Depending on what's being put into RAM and how, this can have negligible effects or significant impact, but the former is what you could expect.
00:25 < toothe> I really like Pop_OS's Appearance theme. But I can't figure out where those settings are located.
00:25 < ][_R_][> What's the DE/WM?
00:25 < toothe> I believe Gnome.
00:27 < edisonbulb> pop os is gnome
00:27 < edisonbulb> gnome 34
00:27 < edisonbulb> *gnome 3
00:27 < toothe> Yes.
00:28 < toothe> So, how does one...change the icons for the X in the window close button?
00:29 < edisonbulb> i'd imagine you would have to modify your theme
00:29 < toothe> right -- how? :)
00:29 < edisonbulb> i don't know sadly
00:30 < toothe> I can't seem to find it on Google
00:30 < toothe> And usually Google knows everything.
00:30 < jml2> must do that search onthe arch wiki
00:30 < toothe> I'm scared.
00:30 < jml2> ~/. paths definitely
00:30 < jml2> toothe, being scared means you're an alex jones follower
00:32 < toothe> jml2: what makes you think I'm not?
00:32 < jml2> toothe, cuz you still have one tooth
00:33 < jml2> and when you say you are scared I can tell it's not a tooth at the very front
00:33 < jml2> :)
00:34 < jml2> gnomre "blblblthwwweee"
00:35 < jml2> toothe, i'm too smart
00:36 < jml2> toothe, i can change my theme with a nice mouse click click click.. faster than you
00:36  * jml2 changes themes constantly :)
00:36 < Sauvin> But can you change your deplorable lack of erudition?
00:40 < jml2> Sauvin, does it kill to be a scared pussy cat when suggesting to use google?
00:42 < toothe> sigh, no one knows.
00:42 < toothe> I"ll throw that question on Stack Overflow.
00:45 < edisonbulb> objective fact: gnome 3 is donkey (censored)
00:50 < lupine> nah, I really like gnome3
00:50 < supernov1h> Hey is there a way outside of grepping/cutting or post processing the output from udevadm, to query a single property of a device? eg udevadm info --query=property --tag=ID_TYPE -p /dev/path/to
00:50 < toothe> I just dislike how there is no Window manager.
00:50 < toothe> lupine: Meaning, if I open a new window, I dislike that there is no tab that says which windows are open.
00:51 < jml2> supernov1h, for an udev rule?
00:51 < jml2> supernov1h, you should generally rely on more than 1 propert
00:51 < jml2> supernov1h, "Trigger events for devices with a matching property value. This option can be specified multiple times and supports shell style pattern matching"
00:52 < jml2> supernov1h, " -p, --property-match=PROPERTY=VALUE"
00:52 < supernov1h> no the other way around jml2, to query a property from a devpath I know exists already
00:53 < jml2> supernov1h, well yeah of course, cat things from /sys
00:53 < supernovah> jml2: but I want to query a speciic property by its name, without using | grep -P '^ID_PROP=' | cut -d= -f2 or something to that effect
00:54 < supernovah> I'm just asking does udevadm or something similar have that prediate
00:54 < jml2> funny my popos vbox install is still here
00:54 < supernovah> predicate*
01:00 < stevendale> Morning
01:00 < stevendale> Slept for 9 hours owo
01:06 < catphish> does anyone know how dm-multipath prevents IOs on different paths getting out of order? i can't find any documentation about how it works
01:10 < tds> catphish: still having fun with that iscsi project? ;)
01:12 < catphish> tds: indeed, i'm getting on ok with iscsi (though it's pretty complicated) however i'm still bugged by this question of how multipath keeps things consistent
01:13 < catphish> scsi has no less than 5 different ways to format a write request :)
01:14 < catphish> it really seems overkill for what it's used for, but i guess people like it
01:14 < stevendale> Why doesn't somebody write a filesystem driver for Wine then a wine systemd module and get NT-like hard drive performance on Linux ;)
01:19 < Aph3x-WL> why not jjust install linux on ntfs and be done with it?
01:21 < meyou> catphish, are you just wanting to know the actual mechanism for your curiosity?
01:22 < catphish> meyou: yes
01:22 < catphish> i'm making an iscsi target with multiple endpoints and i want to understand how requests will arrive when using mulipath
01:23 < catphish> i want to ensure i can eliminate any possibility of race conditions causing data corruption
01:24 < ayjay_t> how would you write a small script that only runs if it hasn't been run in the last four hours? maybe using an environment variable
01:25 < ayjay_t> actually, nvm, unix time duh
01:25 < catphish> ayjay_t: i'd write a unix timestamp to a file
01:25 < djph> ^
01:25 < ayjay_t> why a file > env variable
01:25 < ayjay_t> do i need to a string --> int conversion in the [ test ]
01:25 < bls> ayjay_t: or instead of a script, you could use something like anacron
01:26 < catphish> well environment variables aren't usually considered persistent across multiple executions of something, but if you're talking about a variable in the parent process, sure
01:26 < bls> you just tell it how often to run something, and it'll do all the time management for you
01:26 < meyou> i think you're only going to have one path per host per lun unless you're using some fancy tech on your initiators to have all paths active, in which case said fancy tech would be doing that on its end
01:26 < ayjay_t> bls: yeah it's for .bashrc so i'm going to export it
01:27 < bls> .bashrc is not where you'd put something like that
01:27 < catphish> meyou: interesting, i thought the purpose of multipath was to send requests for the same lun over multiple paths
01:27 < ayjay_t> oh sorry i meant that for catphish
01:27 < ayjay_t> anacron isn't probably optimal because it's .bashrc
01:27 < ayjay_t> bls bashrc is exactly where i want to put something like this
01:28 < ayjay_t> i'm not trying to run it every four hours
01:28 < ayjay_t> i'm trying to run it everytime i log in if it hasn't run in four hours
01:28 < catphish> ayjay_t: sure, but that then only covers it being run in that one shell, it wouldn't know if another user / shell ran it
01:28 < bls> anacron can also handle that
01:28 < ayjay_t> catphish: hmm o rly
01:28 < catphish> ayjay_t: yeah, your environment variables aren't going to survive logging out
01:29 < catphish> you need to persist the data in a file
01:29 < ayjay_t> somehow i should have known that
01:29 < ayjay_t> yeah that's fine
01:29 < noodlepie> What does make "make defconfig" do in Linux?
01:29 < ayjay_t> ugh
01:29 < djph> catphish: ayjay_t just don't put the file in /tmp ;)
01:29 < ayjay_t> lol WHY
01:29 < bls> noodlepie: it dumps out a kernel config will all the default set
01:29 < djph> ayjay_t: why what?
01:29 < catphish>  /tmp should be ok, as long as you don't need it to survive a reboot
01:30 < djph> catphish: hm, I must've misread - thought he said shutdown somewhere (not just logout)
01:30 < ayjay_t> ohh yeah i mean i never shutdown so
01:30 < ayjay_t> going on 400 days yay
01:31 < djph> you slip in the meltdown and spectre patches then?
01:31 < catphish> i had to reboot a server with 950 days of uptime last week, that was sad
01:31 < djph> aw
01:33 < genewitch> http://projectftm.com/#ZL0f4XuE66pShihAya1MDg will this sort of iptables prerouting rule work? or how should i do it? (if there's a better channel to ask in, let me know, too)
01:33 < ayjay_t> it's a goodpoint djph but he comp just kinda sits in my office staying on rofl
01:33 < ayjay_t> although i guess i should run an update cycle or turn it off
01:34 < catphish> in theory, anything that runs untrusted code (even js) needs those patches
01:34 < ayjay_t> yeah definitely, i've heard that
01:34 < catphish> so probably wise
01:34 < ayjay_t> it's just not a priveledged or even used box at all
01:34 < bls> are you running untrusted code or allowing others on the box? yes, you should probably update, otherwise unless you know of something vulnerable you'll be OK to find an appropriate time
01:34 < ayjay_t> it's just sitting there taking up space
01:35 < ayjay_t> i think bls is technically right but it seems like youre walking close to the technical edge
01:36 < dannylee> :p
01:36 < genewitch> I want my port 22 traffic to go straight through, but i want all other IPs connecting to port 22 to get redirected to port 2222
01:37 < djph> what the fuck?
01:37 < noodlepie> bls, thanks! @:P-~
01:37 < aftertaste> what is running on port 2222 genewitch
01:37 < djph> also, you're always gonna match on "-s $youripaddress"
01:38 < genewitch> aftertaste: ssh in a docker
01:38 < aftertaste> oooo
01:38 < catphish> don't you mean -d to match connections to your ip?
01:38 < catphish> oh, no, i understand
01:39 < catphish> you want one user to hit 22, all other users to hit 2222
01:39 < catphish> (remote users)
01:39 < jml2> interestingly enough, checked out my popos vm --- "fira" is heck of a well made font -- scales very well.  using this on my native machine yep
01:39 < phinxy> Trying to debug gpm, when it executes read() to read the first byte of /dev/input/mouse for it to identify what to do next, the error appears "invalid argument". I've tried to compile the source myself.  I don't see how it could be a configuration issue since its the first byte.  PPerhaps the kernel is too modern for gpm? (4.4)
01:39 < genewitch> I am ip 1.1.1.1, server is 2.2.2.2, docker on there is 4.4.4.4 . I get on 1.1.1.1 and ssh to 2.2.2.2 -p 22, i want that to go to sshd on 2.2.2.2. anyone else connects to 2.2.2.2 -p22 gets redirected to 4.4.4.4:2222
01:40 < genewitch> but there's already a rule for 2.2.2.2:2222 to 4.4.4.4:2222
01:40 < jml2> genewitch, 1.1.1.1 is cloudflare's everywhere free dns service..
01:40 < jml2> lol
01:40 < wadadli> so vish console overwrites previous lines, anyone solved this before?
01:40 < catphish> seems like that should be easy with one rule, a redirect with an inverse source ip match
01:40 < wadadli> here's a short screencast https://streamable.com/otor0
01:40 < jml2> genewitch, use 10.x.x.x as an example
01:40 < genewitch> jml2: i am cloudflare, how are you
01:40 < jml2> genewitch, 10.x.x.x is always private
01:41 < genewitch> I am ip 10.1.1.1, server is 10.2.2.2, docker on there is 10.4.4.4 . I get on 10.1.1.1 and ssh to 10.2.2.2 -p 22, i want that to go to sshd on 10.2.2.2. anyone else connects to 10.2.2.2 -p22 gets redirected to 10.4.4.4:2222
01:41 < djph> jml2: or 192.0.2.0/24
01:41 < jml2> genewitch, that doesn't mean anything, because people would need to know the topology of how the virtual bridge i connected
01:42 < jml2> djph, lol
01:42 < jml2> djph, nope :)
01:42 < djph> jml2: hmm?
01:42 < genewitch> so there's no way to route 10.2.2.2:22 to 10.2.2.2:2222 unless the source is 10.1.1.1?
01:42 < jml2> djph, google rfc private ip
01:42 < catphish> jml2: if you want to be pedantic, you should use 192.0.2.0/24 :)
01:43 < jml2> teach him topology!
01:43 < djph> jml2: see RFC5737, TEST-NET-1
01:43 < genewitch> BOGON
01:43 < genewitch> is there another channel to ask?
01:43 < djph> genewitch: ##networking
01:44 < neko> 203.0.113.0/24 will work too?
01:44 < catphish> anyway, why not just: iptables -t nat -A PREROUTING -i eth0 -s ! 1.1.1.1 -p tcp --dport 22-j REDIRECT --to-port 2222
01:44 < djph> neko: indeed it would
01:44 < catphish> one rule to rule them all
01:44 < djph> or 198.51.100.0/24
01:44 < genewitch> catphish: is ok
01:45 < jml2> phinxy, you're still on that gpm huh?
01:45 < catphish> oh, but 2222 isn't a real service, it's another redirect?
01:45 < genewitch> yea
01:46 < catphish> if thats the case, you can do both parts of the redirect at once with a very similar rule
01:46 < catphish> the rule above, but with a DNAT port forward at the end
01:46 < timofonic> Hi
01:46 < catphish> now i must sleep, good luck
01:47 < djph> see ya caliculk
01:47 < jml2> 222 are aspirins
01:47 < genewitch> catphish: iptables says bad argument 1.1.1.1
01:47 < djph> grrr
01:47 < genewitch> (my real ip, 10.1.1.1, whatever)
01:47 < djph> genewitch: check the manpage - I think he swapped the '-s' and the '!'
01:47 < jml2> genewitch, when you say "real ip" that tells me you didn't think it over adequately
01:48 < hhmaster> join ##networking
01:48 < hhmaster> exit
01:48 < genewitch> jml2: what
01:48 < jml2> genewitch, insufficient
01:48 < genewitch> iptables said Bad argument "98.1.2.400"
01:48 < jml2> genewitch, you should show the topology, because docker is all about how the vm's are bridged
01:49 < jml2> genewitch, ..
01:49 < jml2> genewitch, wow
01:49 < phinxy> jml2, how are you doing!
01:49 < jml2> genewitch, ever seen a .400 in an ipv4 address?
01:49 < jml2> lol
01:49 < meyou> genewitch is on ipv7
01:49 < jml2> phinxy, not bad.. how's that gpm thing working?
01:49 < genewitch> http://projectftm.com/#zSlB3c8h_0YY2pPKzvZIFA output of iptables
01:50 < timofonic> Can anyone read me? I'm identified now. I want to know if there's people with experience in HARDCORE DIY data recovery. ATM using ddrescue to slowly reduce read errors. I currently managed to achieve 1480kB bad-sector - 292 bad areas in a 1TiB HDD. It's slow as hell, but it's managing to recover more than I thought
01:50 < genewitch> jml2: i am NOT going to put my public IP in error messages
01:50 < timofonic> Anyone into DIY data recovery and managed to do "miracles"? Mechanical failures are my next step, but I don't trust those nasty tricks such as using a fridge and such...
01:51 < jml2> i have docker on my system, and by default it setups up pretty wacky iptable rules....
01:51 < phinxy> jml2, so-so
01:51 < timofonic> Data recovery professionals wishing to share their obscure secrets are okay too :D
01:51 < phinxy> I have the source and the function that fails. C's read()
01:51 < koala_man> timofonic: you're really hoping to get those last 1.5MB?
01:52 < genewitch> that's the preamble to his bitcoin wallet
01:52 < jml2> timofonic, let me guess.. you use "Azure" cloud XD
01:52 < timofonic> koala_man: I'm sometimes pathologically optimistic and OCD :)
01:52 < jml2> timofonic, I thought cloud folks use raid...
01:53 < meyou> raid is old and busted
01:53 < timofonic> jml2: I'm poor as dirt. I have no money to set up a cheap bunch of disks in RAID :P
01:53 < genewitch> cool kids use zfs
01:53 < timofonic> genewitch: What about XFS? Red Hat propaganda seems quite convincing these days
01:54 < genewitch> i use raid 50 so i don't know
01:54 < timofonic> genewitch: Wishing to donate me a few 2TB+ disks to me? :D
01:55 < noodlepie> RedHat have "business" interests. Linux hackers have "technical" interests! :P
01:55 < jml2> timofonic, he thinks 98.1.2.400 is a valid ipv4 address and didn't understand the error XD
01:55 < jml2> "<genewitch> iptables said Bad argument "98.1.2.400""
01:55 < jml2> tehehe
01:55 < timofonic> noodlepie: Are there a difference when money and big iron is involved? Facefuck sponsors Btrfs too :)
01:56 < timofonic> jml2: WTF? Networking are one of my weak points, but... no, please revisit Networking 101 :P
01:57 < timofonic> to genewitch
01:58 < timofonic> Back to topic: Anyone into data recovery in Linux? I use ddrescue and testdisk. The testdisk author keeps developing it, despite no new stable version since years ( search cgsecurity github testdisk in your preferred search engine)
01:58 < yehor> hello
02:00 < djph> timofonic: backups, and backups of the backups.  "recovery" should only ever be tar or something
02:00 < timofonic> ddrescue-gui seems somewhat acceptable. I miss some graphs to see how things evolve. I miss the functions of that ddrescue log viewer developed in freepascal and maybe the "ddrutility" functions merged into ddrescue. But I'm not a developer, just a luser :P
02:00 < jml2> timofonic,  i quoted genewitch :)
02:00 < timofonic> djph: I know. I know. I know. But how to do backups when there's no money to buy more hardware?
02:01 < djph> timofonic: money to buy media?
02:01 < timofonic> djph: Yes
02:01 < genewitch> are you guys serious
02:02 < genewitch> i know that valid ips end at 300, not 400+
02:02 < djph> timofonic: external hdd then.
02:02 < jml2> timofonic, the data cant that important, just another minecrafting lol
02:02 < djph> genewitch: you're off by 45
02:02 < rascul> genewitch it's not 300 either
02:02 < tds> "end at 300" erm
02:02 < timofonic> djph: No money, I'm a long term unemployed and disabled. These days I'm improving, but ashtma is fucking me again
02:02 < genewitch> sorry, technically 301
02:02 < djph> genewitch: off by 46 now
02:03 < timofonic> jml2: I rarely play videogames these days, despite I have a big bunch of retrocomputing stuff. I like the technology, demoscene
02:03 < xamithan> How does asthma have sex with you?
02:03 < timofonic> jml2: But I'll back to play videogames soon, mostly retro
02:03 < timofonic> xamithan: It's like asthma raping you so bad that it hurts, sort of
02:04 < djph> timofonic: ah, yeah, that'd definitely be a problem.  Honestly, if you can "upgrade" to an external HDD (or hell one of those USB-to-IDE / SATA adapters), you'd be better off than "hope dd works"
02:04 < jml2> timofonic, you can get a simple blogging template thingy for like 5$ with soyoustart
02:04 < jml2> timofonic, it's peanuts.. don't know what you're doing there but if the data is that important you sohuld of gotten two disks.
02:04 < timofonic> djph: Despite of that, those adapters are a lot less reliable for data recovery. Been there, suffered it :)
02:04 < bls> or you can get a free shell account
02:04 < jml2> gtg
02:05 < djph> timofonic: yeah, but they're *fine* for "backup to that spare drive"
02:05 < djph> timofonic: granted "better than hope dd works" is a pretty low bar though.
02:07 < timofonic> I have a 3TiB 2.5" HDD I got for 65 EUR. These days I don't have incomes to buy new hardware and I don't want to sell my retro. I'm considering to relocate to get a job for some months or a year to save money, but still not a convincing plan. Here the unemployment rate at south of Spain is even higher than official statistics :P
02:07 < timofonic> djph: Oh yes. But I'm rarely able to have spare drives. I'm a data junkie :P
02:08 < timofonic> Maybe they day I have 40TiB, I might become more relaxed...
02:08 < sadbox> timofonic: Figure out what's important and keep it multiple places
02:08 < sadbox> accept that you'll lose stuff that isn't
02:09 < djph> ^
02:09 < sadbox> alternatively go work for a tech company in Ireland / Germany / wherever in the EU that isn't on fire right now
02:09 < timofonic> sadbox: Uhm, yes. Also, cataloging data and duplicate that catalogs (it might be database or simple a lenghtly "tree" list) might be wise to do to
02:10 < timofonic> sadbox: Is that possible?
02:11 < sadbox> timofonic: what do you mean?
02:11 < timofonic> sadbox: My official job experience is zero, I have always been a freelance that never pays taxes :P
02:11 < xamithan> Do you got 10 bucks a month?  Google drive is unlimited
02:11 < timofonic> sadbox: Are there a tech company in the EU that isn't on fire right now? :P
02:11 < sadbox> ireland is chock-full of US companies hiring developers
02:11 < timofonic> xamithan: Interesting. It's Google :P
02:12 < sadbox> google / facebook / etc
02:12 < timofonic> sadbox: I'm not a developer, unfortunately. I'm hardly trying to, but my hardware and body keeps failing :P
02:12 < timofonic> Call it hardware: human and electronic :P
02:13 < timofonic> I was at a vocational school learning computer programming, but lung issues made gtfo my study :(
02:14 < koala_man> xamithan: looks like $10 just gets you 1TB
02:16 < xamithan> koala_man: https://gsuite.google.com/pricing.html
02:16 < xamithan> They don't enforce the fewer than 5 users 1TB limit
02:16 < TheNH813> Allright, quick question. I have a long running command that I start in the background with '&' that outputs info every couple seconds, and I want to nuke ALL stdout so I can actually type other commands in. I'v tried redirecting all output to /dev/null and I'v tried running it in a subshell and redirecting all output to /dev/null, and I'v also tried disowning the process. What's the solution?
02:16 < TheNH813> Shell is BASH
02:17 < koala_man> xamithan: interesting. though I imagine they would if you start treating it as if it's actually unlimited
02:17 < bls> TheNH813: it's probably also printing on stderr
02:17 < theorem> TheNH813: nohup
02:17 < bls> TheNH813: command >/dev/null 2>&1 &
02:17 < xamithan> I don't think so.  They use a LOT of deduplication
02:17 < xamithan> I've seen libraries over 200TB
02:17 < TheNH813> bls: Ah, allright. I'l try that.
02:18 < TheNH813> theorem: Dunno what that is, will look it up.
02:19 < TheNH813> bls: Thanks a million.
02:19 < TheNH813> bls: I was being slowly driven insane. XD
02:20 < timofonic> xamithan: I would only put my data on Google Drive only by using paranoid layered and insane encryption
02:20 < timofonic> No deduplication possible, right? :)
02:20 < bls> heh, I learned to use tmux/screen when I need to do stuff like that, give each command its own window
02:20 < bls> then nothing popping up from the background into what you're doing
02:20 < xamithan> Even if it is encrypted they use the hashes for dedup if I recall correctly
02:21 < timofonic> xamithan: How would the entrophy make deduplication become worthy?
02:22 < koala_man> timofonic: there are encrypted file storage services that deduplicate. they do it by using the hash of the data as the encryption key
02:22 < TheNH813> theorem: Nohup seems quite useful as well. I actually need something just like that for a script I'm writing but haven't gotten to that part yet. Thanks for referring me to nohup.
02:22 < rascul> TheNH813 i have a script i called b to launch things in the background for me and save the output in a file to keep my terminal clean: exec "$1" "${@:2}" &>> ${b_out:-~/.b.out} &
02:23 < rascul> looks like voodoo, but i just do 'b some_command' and some_command will run without polluting my terminal
02:23 < xamithan> timofonic: https://patents.google.com/patent/US8199911   There is plenty of services that'll do the same things
02:23 < TheNH813> rascul: I get it. The script does the same thing as bls told me to, but it uses $@ like that to grab the full command you entered within the script.
02:24 < rascul> yep
02:24 < TheNH813> Gonna make one immediately.
02:24 < TheNH813> Straight into /usr/local/bin it goes
02:24 < rascul> i used to have some tab completion setup for it but i dunno where i have that anymore
02:24 < rascul> you can do 'b_out=~/some/log some_command' to have the output go so ~/some/log instead of ~/.b.out
02:25 < TheNH813> That's definitely useful as well. I can still have the output if I want it, but I don't need to see it.
02:25 < timofonic> ddrescue says there's now 1472kB bad-sector - 286 bad areas in the 1TiB HDD image. Who knows what may happen in a few days :P
02:25 < rascul> by default it just goes to ~/.b.out and you can do what you please with it
02:26 < TheNH813> Might set it to create a log by command name and timestamp.
02:27 < rascul> that's quite doable
02:28 < timofonic> xamithan: I'm *NOT* going to say a third party information about that encrypted data. Total black box. It seems like a trick to me. Maybe I missunderstood it
02:29 < TheNH813> rascul: I'l just build a variable  in the script with $1 and $(date +%Y-%m-%d_%H:%m). :D
02:31 < solidfox> hello
02:31 < solidfox> I think I found a bug for my keyboard
02:31 < TheNH813> What is it?
02:31 < solidfox> because it happens in every distro
02:31 < TheNH813> Well, I meant what is the bug?
02:32 < koala_man> if it's an ant, try vacuuming out the crumbs
02:32 < solidfox> TheNH813, well. sometimes when I turn on my acer laptop, the up and right arrow key does nothing, the down arrow key turns off my trackpad
02:32 < Mistell> Or shake it out
02:32 < solidfox> and the function keys don't work
02:32 < xamithan> sometimes?  Can you reproduce it?
02:33 < TheNH813> solidfox: That is unusual. Might the bug have to do with the function key? Does pressing fn+down turn off the trackpad?
02:33 < solidfox> xamithan, I can't intentionally reproduce it.
02:33 < xamithan> Maybe something you spilled got shortcircuited under the board
02:33 < xamithan> Or like the other guy said a stuck key
02:33 < well_laid_lawn> try   blacklist acer_wmi   in /etc/modprobe.d/modprobe.conf
02:34 < TheNH813> If it's not reproducable, it's likely a race condition. Hmm... maybe when it gets initialized or some mildly conductive dirt on the ribbon connector for the keyboard.
02:34 < solidfox> TheNH813, fn+down turns down my volume actually. and that works even now. however, down by itself turns off my trackpad
02:34 < solidfox> a race condition huh? that might be it.
02:35 < solidfox> well_laid_lawn, won't that disable my keyboard entirely
02:35 < TheNH813> slodfox: I'd try well_laid_lawn's suggestion then. See if it is the acer driver.
02:35 < TheNH813> It should just use a generic driver, if I rmeember correctly.
02:35 < well_laid_lawn> no
02:35 < solidfox> ok I'll try it
02:35 < TheNH813> And if it does, I guess boot into recovery mode and edit it back.
02:36 < well_laid_lawn> you could modprobbe -r it first as a check
02:37 < solidfox> ok thanks. I didn't feel like rebooting lol
02:38 < solidfox> its still doing it
02:38 < solidfox> after modprobe -r acer_wmi
02:39 < TheNH813> Hmmm...
02:42 < TheNH813> I guess maybe a reboot is in order then. Perhaps the driver set something that's still set.
02:47 < solidfox> lsmod --help
02:48 < solidfox> usage: lsmod
02:48 < solidfox> lmao
02:48 < TheNH813> Ah, yeah, it's very 'descriptive'
02:49 < TheNH813> It could at east say what it does, but I guess it's self explanatory to some extent.
02:50 < TheNH813> Like the man page does:
02:50 < TheNH813> lsmod - Show the status of modules in the Linux Kernel
02:55 < solidfox> for mod in $(lsmod | cut -d\  -f1); do; modinfo $mod > $mod.txt
02:55 < solidfox> :D
02:56 < solidfox> gotta skip the first one :/
02:58 < timofonic> Anyone mentioned gpm? Please fix that sh1t and make copy & paste to become xterm-like...
02:58 < timofonic> I have no money, but I'll be a slave in exchange :D
02:59 < uplime> solidfox: gross
02:59 < solidfox> uplime, whats wrong
02:59 < uplime> /msg greybot !drlwf
03:00 < uplime> /msg greybot !qefs
03:00 < uplime> also, that last expansion is just going to result in '.txt' I'm pretty sure
03:00 < timofonic> bls: tmux/screen/tmate/mosh are just hacks to workaround an outdated CLI/TUI environment, no real solutions...
03:01 < solidfox> uplime, its not. I use bash
03:01 < uplime> yes im aware
03:01 < genewitch> now everyone can log in as root!
03:01 < uplime> so you have mod defined before the loop then?
03:02 < solidfox> uplime, no. thats how you declare it for a loop
03:02 < solidfox> uplime, no $ in the for loop part
03:02 < solidfox> but only when its used
03:02 < uplime> solidfox: yes im aware. thats not what I was talking about
03:02 < uplime> > $mod.txt is expanded first
03:02 < uplime> but mod isn't set yes, so it results in ""
03:02 < uplime> "".txt is resolved to .txt
03:02 < solidfox> ah I see
03:03 < solidfox> let me try it.
03:03 < uplime> isn't set yet*
03:03 < solidfox> uplime, ya know I would have seen that for myself right?
03:03 < timofonic> solidfox: What about using fish and write a bash/zsh to fish transpiler? :)
03:03 < solidfox> you're just like my brother lol. can't ever let anyone make a mistake xD
03:03 < uplime> i just don't like people writing bad bash code
03:04 < uplime> erm actually
03:04 < uplime> where is the 'done' in that loop
03:04 < uplime> i just realized its not there
03:04 < uplime> and the placement of it can change what I said
03:04 < solidfox> uplime, its the next line. I didn't write it because it didn't matter in this chat.
03:05 < uplime> ok, then > $mod.txt is fine
03:05 < solidfox> yeah
03:05 < solidfox> it worked fine I just tried it
03:05 < uplime> I assumed it was outside the loop, since I thought everything was there on one line
03:05 < uplime> you should still do the rest of the thing properly though :/
03:06 < solidfox> I see why you thought that from glancing at it
03:06 < solidfox> my bad
03:07 < timofonic> ddrescue lowered 1472kB to 1465kB bad-sector. 286 to 278 bad areas :P
03:07 < uplime> while read -r mod; do modinfo "$mod" > "$mod".txt; done < <(lsmod | awk '{ print $1 }')
03:07 < solidfox> uplime, is this better for mod in $(lsmod | cut -d\  -f1 | sed 1,1d); do; modinfo $mod > modinfo-$mod.txt; done;
03:07 < uplime> or: lsmod | awk '{ print $1 }' | while read -r mod; do modinfo "$mod" > "$mod".txt; done
03:07 < uplime> you still shouldn't be reading lines with for
03:07 < solidfox> y not
03:08 < uplime> /msg greybot !drlwf
03:08 < uplime> /msg greybot !faq 1
03:08 < solidfox> you want me to message greybot?
03:08 < uplime> yes
03:09 < solidfox> um
03:09 < solidfox> ok
03:09 < uplime> but the tl;dr of it is, you're depending on word splitting, you're causing more forks than you need, etc, instead of using tools actually meant to read from files/stdin
03:09 < uplime> i don't see why that would be weird... its a bot with information that explains your question
03:09 < timofonic> phinxy: Are you patching/improving gpm? Do you have a repo?
03:16 < solidfox> oh no my mouse lol
03:16 < solidfox> my mouse uses hid-generic
03:17 < edisonbulb> i thought i'd update you on my kernel build experience
03:17 < edisonbulb> i have managed to create an initramfs by doing "cpio -H newc -o > initrd.cpio" followed by "gzip initrd.cpio"
03:17 < edisonbulb> i am satisfied
03:19 < koala_man> edisonbulb: neat. You can also use xz for initramfs these days
03:41 < k12_> How do you do unicode input on linux? The way used to be ctrl+shift+u but fsr that's not working anymore.
03:42 < koala_man> k12_: what do you mean by unicode input?
03:43 < xamithan> Probably easier to just setup a compose key in your DE
03:43 < k12_> koala_man: Being able to input things like the zero width space character, and foreign symbols.
03:44 < koala_man> k12_: you want to input a glyph by its unicode codepoint in X?
03:45 < k12_> I guess, if "glyph" iss what they're called.
03:45 < k12_> It used to be ctrl+shift+u but all of a sudden that doesn't work.
03:45 < k12_> It's been like that for a few months, now.
03:48 < koala_man> k12_: which DE are you using?
03:48 < koala_man> this is not a Linux or X feature, it would be the DE/WM or a third party program
03:49 < k12_> I'm using i3 now, but it was also present in openbox.
03:50 < k12_> I guess what I'll do is see what desktop allows me to do it and how it does it.
03:51 < koala_man> aha, it's iBus
03:52 < k12_> oh
03:54 < koala_man> https://github.com/ibus/ibus/issues/1981 "Since IBus 1.5.15, the feature of Ctrl-Shift-u was consolidated to Ctrl-Shift-e [...] You could output that Unicode character with Ctrl-Shift-e, type 69, and Enter key if ibus-ui-gtk3 is running"
03:54 < koala_man> k12_: does that work --^
03:56 < alexi5> hello ladies and gentlemen
03:59 < k12_> Oh, I see what happens now.
03:59 < k12_> So... with ibus-daemon running, instead of simply relying on memory, a dialog box shows up and I can search for characters.
04:00 < k12_> Is there a way to make it so that the window doesn't show up, though? That may get annoying.
04:01 < edisonbulb> so in my init program how would i keep the kernel from echoing messages and the like
04:01 < edisonbulb> or like at least redirect them to a logfile or something
04:02 < koala_man> edisonbulb: you can use the 'quiet' kernel parameter
04:02 < edisonbulb> thx :)
04:03 < TheNH813> I have ibus 1.5.18 and it's still Ctrl+Shift+U to input character codes.
04:04 < noodlepie> Linux kernel 4.16.7-gentoo stable here!
04:04 < TheNH813> Must be the way it was compiled.
04:04 < TheNH813> noodlepie: I have 4.16.5-1-ARCH.
04:04 < TheNH813> So, just a few micro revisions behind.
04:04 < k12_> oh wow we use the same distro and kernel version.
04:05 < TheNH813> Maybe it's because I use KDE.
04:05 < noodlepie> I only consider Gentoo and Debian, for older machines, quicker to install binary packages rather than building from source, like Gentoo! @:P=~
04:05 < noodlepie> And GNOME!
04:05 < noodlepie> GNU GNU GNU! :P
04:05 < triceratux> Linux 4.16.2-exton
04:06 < edisonbulb> if only i had known i could do this with linux like 10 years ago
04:06 < edisonbulb> so many wasted hours trying to make my own kernel
04:07 < edisonbulb> when it took me half a day w/ linux
04:07 < edisonbulb> to achieve a better result
04:07 < TheNH813> Well, that's the usefullness of open source for you.
04:07 < k12_> So... it doesn't work well with urxvt but works fine with lxterminal.
04:07 < k12_> I guess I'll switch back to lxterminal.
04:07 < rascul> edisonbulb you should have asked 10 years ago ;)
04:07 < TheNH813> urxvt just directly uses libvte, dosen't it?
04:08 < TheNH813> That could be why.
04:08 < TheNH813> Because lxterminal is more like a wrapper.
04:08 < TheNH813> If you want to call it that.
04:09 < TheNH813> noodlepie: I honestly am not the biggest fan of Gnome. I can't get away from KDE for some reason. It just feels right. But then again I only tried Gnome3 back when it was a pile of bugs, so maybe I'm biased.
04:10 < noodlepie> Each to his own! :P
04:10 < edisonbulb> gnome 3 is good, but only if you like it exactly the way your distro ships it
04:10 < noodlepie> Having the choice is nice!
04:10 < edisonbulb> not very customizable
04:10 < TheNH813> Indeed. That's what's good about having a large choice.
04:10 < noodlepie> Freedom is convenient!
04:10 < xamithan> Gnome3 is good with extensions,  it sucks vanilla
04:11 < TheNH813> Either KDE or XFCE. Or JWM+Rox (aka Puppy Linux).
04:11 < TheNH813> Those are my DEs that I like.
04:11 < edisonbulb> xfce is like the most customizable thing i have ever used
04:11 < xamithan> You've never used KDE ?
04:11 < edisonbulb> no
04:12 < xamithan> You hit the right mouse button at the wrong time and change random stuff
04:12 < edisonbulb> i can't even think of a distro that ships kde by default other than lubuntu
04:12 < jml2> edisonbulb, oO
04:12 < xamithan> haha
04:12 < jml2> edisonbulb, you mean lxde
04:12 < jml2> edisonbulb, nub
04:12 < edisonbulb> kubuntu
04:12 < edisonbulb> lol
04:12 < jml2> edisonbulb, right
04:12 < xamithan> mageia is kde i think,  so is opensuse?,
04:13 < jml2> edisonbulb, it's a good distro kubuntu
04:13 < jml2> edisonbulb, opensuse uses kde by default
04:13 < edisonbulb> i think mandriva used to
04:13 < edisonbulb> isn't mageia a continuation of that
04:13 < xamithan> Yeah
04:13 < edisonbulb> thank you for jogging my memory
04:13 < TheNH813> I actually used to hate KDE when I first started using Linux.
04:13 < jml2> edisonbulb, opensuse is one of the most stable distros out there
04:13 < xamithan> chakra, netrunner,  a few others
04:14 < jml2> edisonbulb, you should know it!!
04:14 < jml2> edisonbulb, shame!
04:14 < rascul> opensuse doesn't use kde for default, you're forced to choose when you install
04:14 < TheNH813> Probably because I had 2GB of RAM and a early 2000s GPU at the time and it lagged like no tomorrow.
04:14 < jml2> kde is the defacto desktop for opensuse
04:14 < xamithan> Well it is still the main DE for opensuse
04:14 < TheNH813> But that was then, and this is now. d:
04:14 < jml2> as gnome is the defacto desktop debian, fedora, ... and ubuntu
04:15 < edisonbulb> my first linux comp was a netbook with an atom and like 2gb of memory
04:15 < jml2> :)
04:15 < rascul> xamithan i just said it's not, and explained why...
04:15 < TheNH813> Old Dell Dimension 4600 for me.
04:15 < edisonbulb> soooooo slow
04:15 < edisonbulb> ubuntu 11.04
04:16 < jml2> dont get atom
04:16 < jml2> atom is horrid
04:16 < jml2> only very light-weight desktops should go on these wimpy chips
04:16 < rascul> yeah atom sucks for desktop usage
04:16 < TheNH813> My first Linux based OS was SuperOS 10.10. A modified derivative of Ubuntu 10.10.
04:17 < jml2> TheNH813, SuperOS or SuperAss?
04:17 < jml2> TheNH813, I bet they both suck
04:17 < TheNH813> XD
04:17 < jml2> lol
04:17 < phinxy> timofonic, No I dont do serious stuff like that, only ugly hacks for myself at most.  I saw there were one third party patch by a person to make gpm function with his touchpad.
04:17 < edisonbulb> i want a phone with sockets for ram and cpu
04:17 < edisonbulb> maybe one day
04:17 < edisonbulb> such a thing will exist
04:17 < TheNH813> https://simple.wikipedia.org/wiki/Super_OS
04:17 < xamithan> Why,  by the time you upgrade you'll need a new phone for the newest version of LTE
04:17 < TheNH813> If you're curious.
04:18 < bls> replacable radios too!
04:18 < edisonbulb> bls knows
04:18 < rascul> i just want an open source phone
04:19 < TheNH813> SuperOS had some real nice touches IMO. A disk image mounting tool, flash, media codecs and Wine installed by default.
04:19 < TheNH813> I'm glad I didn't have a horrible first experience and give up.
04:19 < xamithan> Librem 5 phone is supposed to be out next year rascul
04:19 < edisonbulb> i am so excited about that phone
04:19 < rascul> xamithan and it's still not fully open source
04:19 < TheNH813> Ah yes, I heard about that.
04:20 < edisonbulb> first thing like that i've ever seen
04:20 < jml2> edisonbulb, did you crowdfund?
04:20 < xamithan> It isn't?  =(
04:20 < edisonbulb> the most i could donate is like 5 bucks
04:20 < edisonbulb> i'm broke
04:20 < rascul> xamithan it's probably about as close as we can get right now though
04:20 < jml2> LOL
04:20 < jml2> 5 bucks? but you could pre-order one
04:20 < xamithan> Can't be any worse than those phones that came with firefox OS
04:20 < jml2> you need a lot more than 5 bucks to preorder a Librem5 phone XD
04:20 < edisonbulb> yea
04:20 < bls> did they ever ship any jolla devices?
04:20 < rascul> well it's much better than the junk firefox os phones
04:20 < jml2> edisonbulb, liar!
04:21 < jml2> edisonbulb, you didn't even donate 5 bucks did ya?
04:21 < edisonbulb> i'm still just happy that it exists
04:21 < jml2> LOL
04:21 < edisonbulb> jml2, nope
04:21 < edisonbulb> you got me
04:21 < jml2> edisonbulb, you've been punked like falttened tux bitcha!!
04:21 < jml2> edisonbulb, flat on ice!
04:21 < edisonbulb> LOL
04:21 < edisonbulb> could is subjunctive future tense
04:21 < edisonbulb> i didn't imply i had already donated ;)
04:22 < jml2> triceratux, what about you dum dum, did you donate to the librem5 phone?
04:22 < edisonbulb> should have said it in esperanto
04:22 < jml2> lol
04:22  * jml2 bugs triceratux  XDXD
04:23 < jml2> wakeup penguin come on now.. come clean
04:23 < edisonbulb> great now i'm curious
04:23 < jml2> xfce-praising schmucking manica
04:23 < Penguin> What happened?
04:23 < edisonbulb> i gotta look up whether esparanto has a subjunctive voice
04:23 < TheNH813> I'm interested in the Librem 5 for sure. The hardware kill switches, CPU being seperate from baseband processor and purely open source OS would totally sell it for me.
04:24 < TheNH813> Well, the drivers likely aren't fully open source.
04:24 < edisonbulb> omg i love this language
04:24 < jml2> edisonbulb, only like 1000 people in the whole world are geek enough to use it
04:25 < jml2> edisonbulb, almost like a new religion lol.. yeah who wants that!
04:26 < TheNH813> Esperanto is interesting. I remember looking it up a few years ago and really noticing the similarities to existing languages. But it's like they took a lot of the simplest parts and put them together.
04:26 < TheNH813> I don't know any though.
04:26 < triceratux> jml2: nope i went to the bestbuy & grabbed a galaxy j1. something i can take home & install software on. ill believe in the librem when it exists
04:26 < jml2> triceratux, hehehe same branch of thought here
04:26 < edisonbulb> i havent put in the effort to learn any language
04:27 < edisonbulb> but i LOVE reading about the grammar of languagexs
04:27 < jml2> triceratux, tell edisonbulb that 5 dollars is not enough to donate for the librem5 campaigning tehehehe
04:27 < jml2> triceratux, jokes aside, I want a Librem5.. I really do..
04:27 < edisonbulb> haven't they already gotten enough money
04:27 < TheNH813> edisonbulb: I know a extremely tiny amount of Spanish and I'm trying to learn Japanese.
04:27 < edisonbulb> like i thought i read that they were gonna ship it
04:27 < jml2> triceratux, my android here is soaked with daemon-ware.. bad spells on the battery... it tootally is crap
04:28 < jml2> I'd like to see something past a "vaporware" and workable then I'll order one..
04:28 < edisonbulb> Japanese is really cool
04:28 < edisonbulb> so many logograms to memorize o_o
04:29  * jml2 remembers what happened when he donated to the ubuntu-phone campaign of 16+ million.  Shuttleworth just decided to give the money back to everybody.
04:29 < jml2> yeah anyone remember that dumb crowdfunding experiment by the Shuttleworth team? ... kinda silly
04:29 < TheNH813> edisonbulb: Indeed. First one must learn the script though, and then learn the symbols used to replace words.
04:29 < jml2> I sponsored that project.
04:30 < TheNH813> Ubuntu Phone?
04:30 < jml2> yeah
04:30 < jml2> like 6 years ago
04:30 < TheNH813> Too bad it died.
04:30 < edisonbulb> i know a little hirigana and katakana
04:30 < edisonbulb> but memory is really fuzzy
04:30 < bls> I downloaded and played with that for a bit. worked alright as long as you didn't try to use it to call or text
04:31 < TheNH813> I really thought they were gonna actually be successfull.
04:31 < jml2> (yeah this one -- 2014 -- https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/ubuntu-edge#/ )
04:31 < jml2> "$12,814,216 USD raised by 0 backers"  << 0 backers because everybody got refunded
04:31 < jml2> LOL
04:31 < jml2> hahahahah
04:31 < jml2> but it still says 12 million on there...
04:31 < jml2> indiegogo developers left a glitch in their dumb counter
04:33 < jml2> I funded a game for porting to Linux, and it took like years to finally arrive --- I got it couple months back.. but it took years for them to port to linux
04:33 < jml2> originally was only supposed to take like 2 years
04:33 < jml2> finally purchased it on the steam shop..
04:34 < edisonbulb> ctime outputs utc
04:34 < TheNH813> Wow. What game?
04:34 < edisonbulb> fun
04:34 < edisonbulb> i bet there's a qemu flag to fix that
04:34 < jml2> some motorcycle beat-them-up :)
04:34 < TheNH813> Allright.
04:34 < TheNH813> Isn't ctime supposed to be utc?
04:34 < TheNH813> OR am I mistaken?
04:35 < edisonbulb> i think it just dumps the hardware clock value
04:35 < jml2> turns out my valve controller cant cope with it unless I really tireless get it tuned fo rit
04:35 < jml2> lol
04:35 < edisonbulb> which is usually set to utc
04:35  * notmike bites her tongue
04:35 < jml2> TheNH813, i get the title if you're interested -- I did buy it tattle :p
04:36 < jml2> took years for 'em to port it... (serious)
04:36 < toothe> anyone know how the hell to install a GTK theme?
04:36 < TheNH813> The question is, is the performance equal? Is it better? d:
04:36 < jml2> game has good reviews... (this steam app takes forever to load up XD)
04:36 < edisonbulb> pray to saint ignucius
04:37 < TheNH813> jml2: I'l take a look at it. Seems interesting enough I'l check the steam page out.
04:37 < edisonbulb> then the GTK theme shall appear
04:37 < jml2> TheNH813, road redemption
04:37 < jml2> TheNH813, been so long i couldnt find it in my email search
04:38 < edisonbulb> in all seriousness toothe what distro are you using
04:38 < toothe> ahh...figured it out
04:38 < edisonbulb> i dont know the answer but maybe i can find it
04:38 < toothe> Ubuntu MATE
04:38 < toothe> damn...that took a while.
04:38  * notmike vomits
04:38 < TheNH813> toothe: put it in /usr/share/themes ?
04:38 < TheNH813> jml2: Allright, thanks.
04:39 < TheNH813> Or ~/.themes, I think that works too.
04:39 < edisonbulb> https://askubuntu.com/questions/101651/how-to-install-themes-with-gnome-tweak-tool?utm_medium=organic&utm_source=google_rich_qa&utm_campaign=google_rich_qa
04:40 < ghostyy> how do i rescan scsi disks in linux
04:40  * jml2 https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/darkseasgames/road-redemption/updates  --- 2013 -- updates 2017 -- long time
04:40 < jml2> ghostyy, look for the rescan feature :p
04:40 < TheNH813> echo "- - -" > /sys/class/scsi_host/hostX/scan
04:41 < ghostyy> without echo "- - -" > /sys/class/scsi_host/hostn/scan
04:41 < ghostyy> oh
04:41 < ghostyy> i tried that
04:41 < ghostyy> it didnt work
04:41 < TheNH813> Hmmm...
04:41 < ghostyy> i also tried partprobe from parted
04:41 < TheNH813> sysctl maybe.
04:41 < ghostyy> and for i in /sys/class/scsi_device/*/device/rescan ; do echo 1 > $i; done
04:41 < ghostyy> these are in a HBA
04:41 < ghostyy> if that changes anything
04:42 < edisonbulb> i've got a modelling guitar amp sitting in a corner
04:42 < edisonbulb> wonder if it runs linux
04:42 < ananke> ghostyy: yes. you need to issue LIP first
04:42 < ghostyy> ah, how do i do that?
04:42 < ghostyy> i see those in /sys/class/fc_host
04:43 < ghostyy> but i dnt have that folder
04:43 < ananke> ghostyy: echo 1 to a given issue_lip
04:43 < ananke> ghostyy: echo 1 > /sys/class/fc_host/hostX/issue_lip
04:43 < ghostyy> how do i get fc_host folder in /sys/class/fc_host ?
04:43 < ghostyy> ls: cannot access '/sys/class/fc_host': No such file or directory
04:45 < TheNH813> For me it's /sys/class/scsi_host
04:45 < ghostyy> 05:00.0 SCSI storage controller: LSI Logic / Symbios Logic SAS1068E PCI-Express Fusion-MPT SAS (rev 08)
04:46 < ghostyy> thats my sas controller
04:46 < ananke> ghostyy: ohh. no wonder, you wouldn't have fc_host
04:46 < ghostyy> its also in IT mode if that means anything
04:46 < ananke> ghostyy: FC = fibre channel. you have a sas controller. when I saw 'HBA' I thought FC
04:46 < ghostyy> ohhh
04:46 < ghostyy> sorry i am a bit new to this!
04:46 < ananke> ghostyy: does your distro have rescan_scsi_bus.sh or similar tool?
04:47 < Sexynoob> Please im totally stuck
04:47 < TheNH813> What are you stuck on?
04:47 < TheNH813> I don't recall any previous messages from you.
04:47 < ananke> on typing out a question or description of a problem
04:47 < Sexynoob> So I have a question.. Im running wifislax off a bootable usb drive and the @ symbol doesn't work and my other symbols are all on different keys.. Someone help
04:48 < ghostyy> ananke, it comes with sg3_utils, but when i install it it doesnt have that script =_=
04:48 < ghostyy> i am using nixos
04:48 < TheNH813> Sexynoob: Okay, what kind of keyboard do you have?
04:48 < TheNH813> Sexynoob: Sounds like wrong keymap.
04:48 < Sexynoob> I don't know... Qwerty I think
04:48 < TheNH813> Well, what other symbols do you have/need?
04:49 < TheNH813> The description of the wifislax site is in spanish by the looks of it, do you need spanish characters?
04:49 < Sexynoob> No.. I need english
04:50 < Sexynoob> Well the " is on key 2 the _ is on ?
04:50 < TheNH813> Okay. Is your keyboard a standard looking one?
04:50 < Sexynoob> I basically just need the @ right now lol
04:50 < TheNH813> If so, the wifislax distro might use a spanish keymap by default.
04:50 < Sexynoob> Yea a laptop
04:51 < TheNH813> Can you change keyboard layout to en_US or similar?
04:51 < Sexynoob> I don't know how its all in spanish lol
04:51 < TheNH813> I'l download it into a VM and take a look.
04:51 < Sexynoob>  Ok ty
04:52 < Sexynoob> Its a pretty cool distribution of linux.. If it wasn't in spanish would be great!
04:53 < ghostyy> hm
04:53 < ghostyy> well, i ran t he rescan-scsi-bus.sh script
04:53 < ghostyy> i downloaded it and ran it after installed sg3_utils
04:54 < ghostyy> and no new disks
04:54 < TheNH813> Sexynoob: Do you know what user interface it uses? XFCE, LXDE, KDE, Gnome, etc?
04:54 < Sexynoob> I think I found the keyboard config page.. But I'm scared to change anything not knowing what it says
04:54 < ananke> ghostyy: it's possible there are no new disks
04:54 < Sexynoob> No idea.. How do i check that?
04:54 < ghostyy> ananke, i just put them in though ;_;
04:54 < ghostyy> and i made sure they were seated right and the lights turned on and they spun up
04:55 < ananke> ghostyy: doesn't mean that the controller will magically present them to your OS
04:55 < TheNH813> Sexynoob: Is it possible to send a screenshot of the config page?
04:55 < ghostyy> i do see /dev/sg0 through sg11
04:55 < ghostyy> but those arent device nodes, are they?
04:55 < rpifan> id like to interrput and make yall aware that this chan is in fact gnu plus linux
04:55 < ananke> ghostyy: is your controller set up as JBOD?
04:55 < Sexynoob> I'm on my cellphone..
04:55 < ghostyy> ananke, yes, it is in IT mode actually
04:55 < ghostyy> so it just passes through all of the disks
04:56 < ananke> ghostyy: and lsscsi/lsblk don't show your new drives?
04:56 < Sexynoob> If u have email or somethin I can send it to ill take a pic of it
04:56 < TheNH813> Allright.
04:56 < TheNH813> I'l send that in pm.
04:56 < jml2> usually when somebody says they are scared, it often means they are trolling
04:56 < jml2> ^^^
04:56 < Sexynoob> Kk
04:57 < ghostyy> ananke, yeah, neither of them do
04:57 < notmike> I ain't never ran from nothing but the police.
04:57 < ananke> ghostyy: well, time to reboot and visit your sas controller's interface
04:57  * jml2 noticed notmike is a girl
04:57 < ghostyy> ;-;
04:57 < ghostyy> i guess so
04:57 < ghostyy> thank you very much for your help
04:58 < snugger> i'm tired of life :-(
05:03 < Sexynoob> Sent
05:03 < Pentode> join the club
05:03 < Pentode> free special gift for new members!
05:04 < TheNH813> Sexynoob: Okay.
05:05 < Sexynoob> Its giving me the option to delete the Spanish keymap..?
05:05 < TheNH813> Sexynoob: Go to the third tab.
05:05 < jml2> "* notmike bites her tongue"
05:05 < jml2> notmike, hahahaha
05:05 < Sexynoob> K
05:05 < jml2> notmike, gotcha
05:06 < TheNH813> Add English US, and delete the Spanish one.
05:06 < TheNH813> The add button has a '+'
05:07 < TheNH813> After that is done, you can also change the language.
05:07 < TheNH813> I can tell you how.
05:08 < snugger> Can someone please expalin why anybody would call Arch "minimal"?
05:08 < Disconsented> Because you start with almost nothing installed
05:08 < TheNH813> It's very minimal. Dosen't have much installed to begin with, and you make your own choices.
05:08 < snugger> Or adhearing to the KISS philosophy
05:08 < jml2> KISSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS
05:08 < Sexynoob> Ok under the ingles menu it has aleman, Barbara , EurKey, Filipino, France's, Indio, ingles camarun , ingles EE UU, ingles Ghana, ingles Nigeria, irlandes, simbolos de teclado - but no america
05:08 < jml2> KISS === KEEP IT SIMPLE STUPID
05:09 < snugger> TheNH813: systemd and glibc is installed
05:09 < snugger> Those are NOT minimal
05:09 < jml2> for those who DON'T know
05:09 < Disconsented> To get a functioning system
05:09 < Disconsented> yeah they kinda are
05:09 < snugger> lol
05:10 < TheNH813> Sexynoob: Hmmm...
05:10 < TheNH813> Let me see which one is best.
05:11 < Sexynoob> I changed it to ingles Canada and still same thing
05:11 < notmike> Gotcha
05:11 < TheNH813> You will need to log out and back in for changes to take effect.
05:12 < Sexynoob> I knew that lol
05:12 < Sexynoob> Oh lol ok
05:12 < ShapeShifter499> hi
05:12 < TheNH813> After that, you will likely want to change the language.
05:12 < Sexynoob> K
05:12 < ShapeShifter499> does anyone know if I can use a dropbear generated ssh key with openssh client?
05:12 < TheNH813> ShapeShifter499: Hello.
05:13 < TheNH813> I thin so. SSH keys should be standardized.
05:13 < ShapeShifter499> I'm getting errors trying to use a generated private/public pair from dropbear   "Load key ".ssh/servers-local/rsa_key": invalid format"
05:15 < Sexynoob> It works!!!!! Thank u sooo much
05:15 < TheNH813> No problem. Just note the right alt key may create french symbols when pressed wiht letters.
05:16 < Sexynoob>  Ok
05:17 < TheNH813> The language settings option has a blue flag on it.
05:17 < TheNH813> So if you find that changing the interface to english should be easy as well.
05:17 < snugger> I think what distros like BunsenLabs and Crunchbangplusplus are doing is great. It's introducing newbies to (fairly) minimal window managers with a complete set of applications
05:17 < snugger> I think more distros should do this
05:18 < snugger> Manjaro is a great example of this
05:18 < Disconsented> Why should distros change their niche?
05:19 < snugger> There's Arch based distros like ArchLabs and debian based distros like Crunchbangplusplus, nothing seemingly on the RPM side of things
05:19 < bls> Disconsented: because there's obviously only one right way to have a default package list and they're all *wrong* except for the default package list that's exactly what I have installed
05:19 < snugger> Just thoughts on potential new project ideas
05:20 < TheNH813> BRB
05:24 < jml2> debian-based like "Ubuntu"
05:24 < TheNH813> Allright, back.
05:24 < jml2> more than anything lol
05:24 < jml2> jc how'd he miss that ? XD
05:31 < TheNH813> Sexynoob: Are you gone, or do you still need help?
05:31 < TheNH813> If no reply in two minutes, I'm going.
05:47 < alexey-nemovff> hi folks!
05:49 < jim> hi
05:50 < alexey-nemovff> [22:49:23]  <alexey-nemovff> how're your GNU-Linux boxes doing?
05:56 < pabed_> hi , I define Default Gatway in /etc/sysconfig/network-scripts/ifcfg-ens160  but It dosn't work ?https://paste.linux.community/view/b4b3da65
05:59 < jml2> pabed_, BOOTPROTO needs to be set to something
06:01 < jml2> also GATEWY is misspelled
06:02 < jml2> "There is no functional difference between setting static and none; The values are functionally equivalent."
06:02 < jml2> ok so it can be set to none, but it looks like gatewy is misspelled lol
06:03 < pabed_> jml2: when I set this gate way in other machin , it works
06:05 < pabed_> and I set jus value for GETEWY not anything else
06:06 < jim> pabed_, check all your net settings, particularly the netmask, your IP and the gateway's IP
06:07 < jml2> pabed_, are you allowed to access google's search engine from iran?
06:07 < pabed_> I checked many times
06:07 < jml2> because a quick search shows you mispelled your gateway variable name
06:08 < jim> the thing is, your IP and the gateway IP have to be in the same subnet as defined by the netmask
06:08 < pabed_> yes , as I said , I set this ip and subnet mask and default gateway in other machine , it works
06:08 < jim> the same IP?
06:09 < jml2> I'm not talking on the right of "="
06:09 < pabed_> I think there is something wrong in config faile or service or whatever I don't know
06:09 < jml2> I'm talking you do not have "GATEWAY=" (you have it spelled as "GATEWY=")
06:09 < jim> pabed_, maybe it's dns?
06:10 < jim> can you ping 8.8.8.8?
06:10 < pabed_> jim: "ping 8.8.8.8" does not need dns
06:10 < jim> exactly my point
06:10 < pabed_> jim: no
06:10 < jim> ok
06:11 < jim> can you ping your gateway
06:11 < pabed_> jim: yes i can ping my gateway
06:11 < domhnall> ./ip addr |./grep 'inet' <--works  (in path) but calling them out of path does not. noob question, what's going here?
06:12 < jim> ok, so that means your physical connection to the gateway is good
06:12 < domhnall> otherwise it is 'command not found'
06:12 < nai> domhnall: check your PATH variable
06:12 < n-iCe> who knows a software to check if all they keyboard keys are working? or how can I check?
06:13 < n-iCe> I think alt is not working, no idea why in a new laptop.
06:13 < pabed_> jim: I think all thing returns to GW
06:13 < jml2> n-iCe, cat >> /dev/null and type!!!
06:13 < domhnall> PATH=/usr/local/sbin:/usr/local/bin:/usr/bin:/usr/bin/site_perl:/usr/bin/vendor_perl:/usr/bin/core_perl
06:13 < domhnall> _=/usr/bin/env
06:13 < n-iCe> thanks!
06:13 < jml2> n-iCe, that's what i do, and when do ctl-c ;-0
06:13 < nai> n-iCe: xev
06:13 < n-iCe> ctrl is what is not working sorry
06:14 < nai> jml2: that wouldn't display alt or ctrl
06:14 < n-iCe> I need to check ctrl
06:14 < jml2> true
06:14 < jim> domhnall,  abd when you: echo $PATH you get the path you set back?
06:14 < domhnall> /bin/bash
06:15 < domhnall> oh path...
06:15 < domhnall> tehe...
06:15 < nai> domhnall: "which ip"
06:15 < n-iCe> so how can I check
06:16 < domhnall> erm, no ip in (path....)
06:16 < n-iCe> its weird key looks ok, I removed the key is ok, no dust or something
06:16 < n-iCe> what can it e??
06:16 < n-iCe> be, is just the lefy ctrl
06:16 < n-iCe> which I use a lot lol
06:16 < domhnall> and im in the directory
06:16 < nai> n-iCe: install xev, run xev, press key
06:17 < nai> domhnall: type /usr/bin/ip
06:17 < n-iCe> unable to find xev
06:17 < jml2> :)
06:18 < domhnall> bash: /usr/bin/ip: No such file or directory
06:18 < nai> might be xorg-xev or similar
06:18 < nai> domhnall: then what directory are you in?
06:18 < jim> what dir do you have ip in?
06:18 < domhnall> '/bin'
06:18 < jim> (those two should be the same dir)
06:18 < jml2> i think usually it is in /sbin
06:18 < n-iCe> nothing nai
06:19 < jml2> take back -- here it's /bin/ip XD
06:19 < jim> ip?
06:19 < nai> ok, what you're distro
06:19 < nai> what's your* goddamnit
06:19 < n-iCe> hehe debian
06:19 < jim> if ip were in sbin, usually that's not in the path and you woulnd't be able to run it
06:19 < nai> domhnall: what's your distro?
06:19 < jml2> jim, depends
06:19 < domhnall> Gentoo
06:20 < jml2> iirc it may have been in /sbin in debian previously
06:20 < nai> domhnall: yeah... are you sure you're ready for gentoo?
06:21 < jml2> ip is next generation networking tools from package "iprout2"
06:21 < jml2> ./iproute2./
06:21 < domhnall> nai: yeah, it's needed right now.
06:22 < nai> n-iCe: try x11-utils
06:23 < jml2> domhnall, whatever distro, generally you would have even samples of bash startup scripts upstream or /etc/skel
06:24 < jml2> (find /etc/skel   generally shows dot things that get copied to new user folders when creating new users)
06:24 < nai> domhnall: https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki//usr_move
06:25 < nai> or just add /bin to your PATH
06:26 < jml2> some users try to get too ahead of themselves...
06:26 < jml2> tehehe
06:26 < cmj> is /bin not in skel path?
06:26 < nai> should be
06:27 < domhnall> nope...
06:35 < TheDcoder> Hello. Is there a good program which I can use in my script to wait for a shortkey key?
06:36 < nai> domhnall: looking at the stage3 archive, it seems that /etc/profile.env adds /bin to PATH
06:36 < nai> TheDcoder: what is a shortkey key?
06:36 < TheDcoder> something like a simple key combination
06:37 < TheDcoder> Ctrl + Any Alphabet
06:37 < TheDcoder> or something like that
06:37 < domhnall> nai: yah, I saw that, that's like where something went wrong.
06:38 < domhnall> 'bzip2 not found'
06:38 < nai> TheDcoder: do you want to trap Ctrl+C ?
06:39 < TheDcoder> Not Ctrl + C specifically, any key combination is okay for me
06:39 < domhnall> that'd be from the -j filter of tar iirc...(checking...)
06:39 < TheDcoder> Maybe Alt + 1
06:39 < domhnall> didn't need that.
06:41 < domhnall> nai: thanks for pointing that out...
06:41 < nai> TheDcoder: there's no "simple" way to do this. what is your script doing?
06:43 < TheDcoder> I am planning to build a loop which runs a command when a key combination is pressed. The reason for why I can't just use the Desktop Environment's built-in shortcut system is that I will be running the script as root.
06:43 < TheDcoder> I start the script as root and it keeps running in the background waiting for a key press
06:43 < TheDcoder> when the user presses the desired key combination it runs a command
06:44 < TheDcoder> that is the idea anyway :)
06:44 < nai> so you're talking about X keypresses?
06:44 < TheDcoder> Yes, that is correct
06:45 < TheDcoder> I could build my own program but that would be overkill for a simple task...
06:46 < TheDcoder> don't want to re-invent the wheel :^)
06:46 < Sauvin> What language?
06:46 < TheDcoder> Sauvin: was that for me?
06:48 < snugger> W-what would happen if, somehow, iana-etc was removed from the system?
06:50 < domhnall> snugger: for auditing purposes, that 'somehow' should be known eventually.
06:53 < snugger> Dear lord networkmanager is a beast
06:56 < Loshki> Amen
06:57 < timofonic> ddrescue lowered 1472kB to 1465kB to 1431kB bad-sector. 286 to 278 to 251 bad areas :D
07:05 < domhnall> fixed. tho not sure if that was a fix of just a missed stepped.
07:10 < snugger> '
07:10 < snugger> |
07:10 < wizzi> How can i upgrade grub0.97 to grub2 ?
07:11 < wizzi> dual booting
07:11 < [R]> wizzi: get grub2, run grub-install
07:11 < [R]> prfit
07:12 < wizzi> i did it but nothing happened
07:13 < domhnall> wizzi: grub-install /dev/sda (sdb,sdc...etc)
07:13 < [R]> you did what... what do you mean "nothing happened"
07:21 < wizzi> E: Unable to correct problems, you have held broken packages.
07:21  * [R] shakes his head and gives up
07:32 < wizzi> any solution to upgrade grub ?
07:41 < Kiso_> yo
07:41 < Kiso_> can someone here point me in the right direction for getting help with LKM dev?
07:43 < [R]> Kiso_: you're going to have to be a little more specific...
07:44 < Kiso_> im in an OS class and am working on a project to make a kernel module to store key-vlaue pairs
07:45 < Kiso_> and the teacher has given zero resources on how to actually write a kernel module aside from simple hello world examples that dont do any io
07:46 < Kiso_> essentially im trying to figure out how to communicate with the module
07:46 < [R]> "communicate"?
07:47 < Kiso_> ie, send the module data and have it store it, and send it back to me when requestied
07:47 < [R]> how do you want to "send" it?
07:47 < Kiso_> from a program in uh, userspace?
07:48 < Kiso_> ive found this http://derekmolloy.ie/writing-a-linux-kernel-module-part-2-a-character-device/ but its not 100% what im looking for and a bit hard to understand
07:49 < [R]> ok
07:49 < [R]> and how do you want the program in userspace to do it
07:50 < Kiso_> for now i want to be able to "set" a var in the kernel and then "get" it later
07:51 < Kiso_> im confused about how to add functions to the kernel module and then call them from the userspace program
07:51 < [R]> how do you want userspace to set the variable?
07:52 < Kiso_> not sure what you mean there
07:53 < [R]> there is /proc, there is /sys, there is /dev...
07:53 < Kiso_> not sure what those are
07:53 < [R]> well, sounds like you ont know linux 101
07:53 < [R]> and you're just going to fail writing a module if you dont know that
07:53 < [R]> you gotta know how to use a kernel before you write for the a kernel
07:53 < Kiso_> yeah, this OS couse is hella unorganized
07:55 < [R]> that sound quite unfortunate
07:56 < Kiso_> yeah, at this point im just poking around, trying to get something to compile
07:58 < Kiso_> gonna see if i can find some kernel module code on github to learn from ;x
08:00 < natten> I'm using the docker syslog driver to log stuff from my application to syslog -> rsyslog -> loggly. However whenever i log an error. "journalctl -o verbose" and rsyslog/loggly detects it as "Informational" severity.
08:00 < natten> Anyone knows anything i can try?
08:15 < curiousx> Hi there
08:18 < Bebef> hi
08:19 < curiousx> Yo! Bebef, i'm testing dunst, could you please write me a message tab completin' my nick ?
08:20 < Bebef> I have a HiDPI display. I managed to adapt Grub and the text TTYs to a large font, but the luks-unlock for my encrypted LVM still has a tiny font. Any hints on how to change that font?
08:20 < Bebef> curiousx: There you go :)
08:20 < curiousx> Oh! man, still doesn't work, no problem, thanks
08:21 < curiousx> i mean, i should have seen a dunst message, but np
08:22 < curiousx> Sorry, i have never used encryption for my disks, but...
08:24 < curiousx> you settled this one parameter like this right ? GRUB_GFXPAYLOAD_LINUX=keep
08:24 < curiousx> and this other one like this ? GRUB_GFXMODE=auto
08:24 < Bebef> Nah, Grub is OK
08:25 < Bebef> It's the initrd I guess
08:25 < Bebef> I managed to set the keymap in the initrd but I have no idea on how to change the font.
08:25 < curiousx> Which distro ?
08:30 < masber> good afternoon, iptables is blocking me traffic from 129.94.15.158 to 129.94.72.19:9995 and i don't know why? could someone please help me to understand which rule is rejecting the packages? https://bpaste.net/show/0779f1fb3fb0
08:33 < [R]> masber: iptables -vnL
08:35 < masber> [R], https://bpaste.net/show/4eb2e5d57f2e ok I guess it is this one? https://bpaste.net/show/4eb2e5d57f2e 2   194 REJECT     tcp  --  eth2   *       0.0.0.0/0            0.0.0.0/0           tcp dpts:1024:65535 reject-with icmp-port-unreachable
08:35 < [R]> well remove it and see
08:36 < Bebef> curiousx: Parrot
08:37 < revel> masber: Run `sudo iptables -Ln`, please.
08:37 < revel> -n for numeric output.
08:38 < revel> Since one of ah-esp-encap/mysql/owamp-control could be 9995.
08:39 < revel> Oh, wait. masber: "tcp dpts:1024:65535 reject-with icmp-port-unreachable" could be it.
08:39 < masber> revel, yes that is the one rejecting the packages as I can see it though the counters
08:40 < revel> Right.
08:51 < Bebef> curiousx: This looks light the right pointer... so far https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=859458
08:57 < curiousx> sorry Bebef, i don't really know how to help
08:58 < Bebef> curiousx: np :)
09:18 < CrazyTux> does Mageia have a larger community as compared to that of Mint?
09:19 < CrazyTux> number of developers and dedicated teams?
09:24 < Bebef> CrazyTux: That's curiouns, I've never heard of Mageia until just now. Mint OTOH is known (better) IMHO.
09:25 < Bebef> CrazyTux: Of course that's not necessarily related to community size
09:25 < CrazyTux> Bebef, never heard of Mageia?
09:25 < Bebef> Nope
09:25 < CrazyTux> ok
09:26 < CrazyTux> have you used Mint and Ubuntu?
09:26 < revel> I just know that it's RPM-based.
09:26 < Bebef> CrazyTux: Yes, both
09:26 < CrazyTux> Bebef, are they both same in performance?
09:26 < CrazyTux> ease of use?
09:26 < Bebef> CrazyTux: I would assume so. What exactly do you mean by performance?
09:27 < CrazyTux> stability
09:27 < Bebef> that's not even remotely the same
09:27 < Bebef> But yes, they're stable too
09:27 < CrazyTux> did you face any such issue like desktop freezing?
09:27 < Bebef> never
09:28 < CrazyTux> I have been using Ubuntu Mate LTS.
09:28 < CrazyTux> Sometimes my laptop freezes.
09:30 < Rembo> Hello everyone, i have the following curl error on my debian 9 : https://hastebin.com/ujubovosab.md , can someone help?
09:32 < Bebef> Rembo: curl --version ?
09:32 < hernan604> CrazyTux: change your laptop
09:32 < CrazyTux> I am using Manjaro also on the same laptop. I don't face such issues while using Manjaro.
09:33 < hernan604> CrazyTux: linux is linux... same stability. It might have some better hardware support with another distro
09:33 < Bebef> CrazyTux: Never heard of that either. How do you choose distros? Most exotic first? ;)
09:33 < CrazyTux> is there any setting that I need to change for Ubuntu to not freeze?
09:33 < revel> That depends on what is causing it to freeze.
09:34 < CrazyTux> Bebef, Manjaro is at the top in Distrowatch ranking.
09:34 < hernan604> CrazyTux: manjaro is more bleeding edge... it might have some driver that ubuntu doesnt. However, ubuntu updates without breaking your system... not that manjaro will break, but you might experience some upgrading troubles you dont get in ubuntu
09:34 < Bebef> CrazyTux: There's a lot of other stuff I hever heard of
09:34 < hernan604> ubuntu is "safe", not bleeding edge
09:34 < CrazyTux> I update/upgrade manjaro regularly. Haven't encountered any breakage so far.
09:35 < hernan604> good for you
09:35 < hernan604> is your computer hot ?
09:35 < CrazyTux> hernan604, no. why?
09:35 < revel> They hold back updates from Arch slightly, so it's probably a bit less likely to break stuff. On the downside, updates are massive.
09:35 < hernan604> because temperature makes it freeze sometimes
09:36 < oiaohm> hernan604 there is trouble that comes out of the Ubuntu kernel at times.    The ubuntu kernel has a lot of third party patches as well.
09:36 < revel> And it's a bit harder to figure out which exact package broke something, maybe.
09:36 < CrazyTux> hernan604, but, why it doesn't happen with manjaro?
09:36 < hernan604> CrazyTux: because maybe manjaro supports your hardware better... maybe it has a newer version of something that ubuntu doesnt
09:37 < hernan604> why do you want ubuntu ?
09:37 < hernan604> just use manjaro if it works fine
09:37 < hernan604> its the same
09:37 < hernan604> both are linux
09:37 < Bebef> Is the ranking on distrowatch purely based on "hits per day"?
09:37 < oiaohm> hernan604: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/Kernel/MainlineBuilds  this is required on Ubuntu at times.
09:37 < CrazyTux> they say rolling release distros could cause some stability issues. As an alternative OS I am using Ubuntu.
09:38 < oiaohm> hernan604: saying both are just Linux over looked the third party patches that bring hell.
09:38 < CrazyTux> and btw, I am using the latest release of Ubuntu Mate LTS. 18.04.
09:38 < Bebef> Well, 18.04 is brand new. Maybe you should wait for 18.04.1
09:39 < Bebef> I'm not upgrading my LTS until 18.04.1
09:39 < hernan604> check your /var/log/syslog also to try discover why it halts
09:40 < CrazyTux> ok
09:41 < hernan604> also check if there is some patter that makes it freeze... ie, you are opening something that uses too much power ie. some 3D drawing app
09:42 < hernan604> oh also, the window manager you use might affect a lot also
09:42 < hernan604> i dont know what ubuntu uses now, but their "ubuntu unity" is slow as hell and you should avoid using that
09:42 < hernan604> try to switch to xfce
09:43 < hernan604> manjaro uses xfce i think
09:43 < oerheks> hdd worn out, tried too many distros
09:43 < hernan604> or they have some options mate/xfce CrazyTux
09:44 < CrazyTux> I am using Mate.
09:44 < CrazyTux> and Ubuntu has abondoned Unity now.
09:50 < plexigras> if i plug in my usb stick /dev/sdb shows up but i cant mount it nor can i see it when i run lsblk
09:53 < Triffid_Hunter> plexigras: what does dmesg say? maybe there's some problem with it?
09:56 < plexigras> this is the dmesg output http://ix.io/19Lv
09:57 < Triffid_Hunter> plexigras: seems fine, what about file -Ls /dev/sdb ?
09:58 < plexigras> > /dev/sdb: writable, no read permission
09:58 < pankaj> Is their any standard command to find out information abut my RAM (Not how much memory used or free) but like speed, type etc.
09:58 < Triffid_Hunter> pankaj: lshw
09:59 < pankaj> Triffid_Hunter: OK
09:59 < oerheks> dmidecode
09:59 < pankaj> Triffid_Hunter: Command not found.
09:59 < pankaj> Triffid_Hunter: Is their any standard command for all linux distribution?
10:00 < oerheks> sudo dmidecode --type 17
10:00 < Triffid_Hunter> pankaj: yeah, lshw. you have to install it first
10:00 < oerheks> sudo lshw -short -C memory
10:00 < oerheks> heh, lshw is standard
10:01 < plexigras> Triffid_Hunter: what does `/dev/sdb: writable, no read permission` mean?
10:02 < Triffid_Hunter> plexigras: means your disk is spitting read errors
10:02 < Triffid_Hunter> plexigras: should be some more info in dmesg, but likely it's dead
10:02 < plexigras> great
10:03 < pankaj> Triffid_Hunter: OK.
10:05 < okamis_> What are good key storages for keeping passwords in?
10:18 < rangergord> what's the best virtualization tech for casual users to use on a home server? Like the Ubuntu of VMs. KVM/Xen/VBox/VMware? I've been using VBox for desktop but in this case it's something I want running all the time.
10:19 < rangergord> without ever having it crash due to the virtualization tech. I'll be away from home most of the time.
10:20 < okamis_> What you plan on running?
10:21 < revel> You could just get away with some containery stuff instead, depending on what you want. Though "the Ubuntu of VMs" is probably VBox.
10:23 < mAniAk-_-> rangergord: theres no "best" really, depends on what you know and need
10:23 < rangergord> I want to run an old app at work that has specific installation requirements that I want to set up once, then be able to copy to different systems when I need to, and it runs. I can't script the installation, it requires stuff from the internet.
10:23 < pressure679> Termux on Android, though I have not figured out how to add a distro repository.
10:23 < rangergord> mAniAk-_-: I only know VBox, but I want things like "run reliably at startup", "don't crash", etc
10:24 < mAniAk-_-> that can be done with vbox as well
10:24 < rangergord> what about performance? What's the performance penalty % for using VBox?
10:25 < mAniAk-_-> not much of a difference compared to others that make use of cpu features that speed this up
10:25 < mAniAk-_-> containers will be faster though
10:25 < rangergord> I need a complex moveable sandbox, don't think containers help when installation consists of apt + pip + npm + god knows what
10:25 < rangergord> and I believe the installers for some of these do some native compiling
10:26 < mAniAk-_-> you can build your own docker image
10:26 < revel> Can't you just `apt install docker` or something?
10:26 < mAniAk-_-> that does all of those steps
10:26 < rangergord> I don't trust that stuff to still work 2 years from now
10:26 < revel> Why not?
10:26 < rangergord> I looked into Docker, I don't trust it
10:26 < rangergord> API breakage in Docker itself. A proper VM is truly eternal.
10:27 < mAniAk-_-> no you'll probably have to keep tinkering with it for it to keep working for so long, youll have to do that with most options
10:27 < rangergord> well, should be, anyway
10:27 < rangergord> my VBox VMs from 5 years ago still work today, it's just virtualization tools that must be reinstalled. And I figure the real production virtualization tech is even more stable.
10:27 < jhodrien> Can you not just use VirtualBox with headless autostarted VMs?
10:27 < mAniAk-_-> a full vm in kvm/vbox/xen/vmware then? you can usually convert the disk image type so you can run in wherever you want
10:28 < rangergord> jhodrien: that's what I'm thinking I'll end up doing
10:28 < revel> What's the Docker API for, exactly? And do you plan on using it anyway?
10:29 < rangergord> revel: I don't want to use Docker, mAniAk-_- was suggesting I do, but I won't
10:29 < rangergord> I think Docker works if you're ready to keep updating stuff all the time, not in my situation
10:29 < revel> Well, that's probably the highest-performance solution you have.
10:30 < rangergord> OK, one last question: is it better to use the Debian/Ubuntu repos' VBox, or the latest off the website? What's considered more stable?
10:31 < revel> Stick with the one in the repos if you want to stay stable.
10:31 < jhodrien> Well, if it was me, I'd use KVM ;)
10:31 < mementomori> hi!
10:33 < rangergord> ok, thanks
10:34 < mementomori> I need some help mounting a filesystem from a GPT disk. kernel identify the disk as /dev/sdd. gdisk shows the disk had 2 partitions but /dev/sdd1 and /dev/sdd2 are missing. the partitions' types are both "0700 Microsoft basic data"
10:41 < mAniAk-_-> parted -l output?
10:55 < MrLawrence> Hello, is there a command line tool I can use to send bytes to a certain address and port? I was using telnet but that sends stuff I don't want at the start.
10:55 < milpool> nc
10:56 < MrLawrence> thanks
10:57 < revel> (aka netcat)
10:59 < MrLawrence> I thought that when you opened a socket you also sent a message along with it?
11:00 < nai> ∕set bufli
11:00 < nai> oops
11:02 < Triffid_Hunter> MrLawrence: heh bash can do that by itself.. echo blah > /dev/tcp/hostname/port ;)
11:02 < LucaVanzin> hello I try to add a bridge with rc.local (ubuntu) on lan0 and lan1 interface. These interfaces are configured in /etc/network/interfaces Actually rc.local says lan0 Host Name lookup failure. In dmesg lan0 appears after the rc.local execution. Could I add a wait condition on rc.local on lan0 availability before create a bridge? Is there another better way to do this?
11:03 < revel> Triffid_Hunter: Where do you get /dev/tcp from?
11:03 < Triffid_Hunter> revel: bash
11:03 < Triffid_Hunter> revel: it doesn't actually exist, bash intercepts it and sets up relevant sockets
11:04 < revel> Oh, it's a bash specific thing?
11:04 < Triffid_Hunter> try this: ( echo $'GET / HTTP/1.1\nConnection: Close\n' >&3 && cat <&3 ) 3<>/dev/tcp/google.com/80
11:04 < revel> Okay.
11:04 < Triffid_Hunter> LucaVanzin: openrc solved that sort of thing ages ago, are you using some other boot script manager?
11:06 < revel> Ubuntu, so, systemd, probably.
11:07 < LucaVanzin> <Triffid_Hunter> Thanks, I actually not able to chek what boot script manager my system is using
11:07 < Triffid_Hunter> oh, systemd? no idea, good luck
11:08 < MrLawrence> Hey, is there any way I can tell netcat to immediately send something as soon as it connects?
11:08 < LucaVanzin> Is there a way to show up what is the used script boot manager
11:09 < Triffid_Hunter> MrLawrence: echo blah | nc .. ?
11:09 < revel> If you're on a recent Ubuntu and aren't sure, then it's probably systemd.
11:10 < LucaVanzin> revel, yes it seems that systemd is the manager used
11:11 < aib> MrLawrence: anything you pipe to netcat's stdin will be sent. responses will be available at its stdout
11:11 < aib> ehh, didn't realized I was scrolled up and there already were other responses
11:12 < MrLawrence> Thanks guys
11:13 < aib> I'm trying to get used to using socat, but it feels unwieldy
11:14 < aib> it's probably all the capital letters
11:14 < Triffid_Hunter> aib: well yeah, it's a swiss army knife, but most tasks are best done with a simple butter knife :P
11:15 < aib> hahaha, yeah :)
11:24 < oiaohm> Triffid_Hunter: https://www.wired.com/2013/10/you-can-kill-a-man-100-ways-with-this-crazy-swiss-army-knife/  It really depends on the swiss army knife
11:27 < hernan604> why would you kill a man a 100 ways ? only 1 needed
11:27 < stevendale> Hi
11:28 < revel> hernan604: So people think there's tons of murderers about and it's not just one person.
11:29 < oiaohm> hernan604: the reality is that knife if it was ever poisoned is that it would kill its owner attempting to use it.
11:34 < djph> oiaohm: er, what?
11:34 < oiaohm> Triffid_Hunter: the first Swiss army knife only has 4 tools  blade, reamer, can-opener, screwdriver.   Yes the reality of multi function knifes are like some software starts off sane enough after they have enough features they come harmful to end user.
11:36 < natten> I'm using the docker syslog driver to log stuff from my application to syslog -> rsyslog -> loggly. However whenever i log an error. "journalctl -o verbose" and rsyslog/loggly detects it as "Informational" severity/priority. Anyone know how i can log errors and warnings?
11:41 < RevanOne> hey
11:41 < RevanOne> anyone familiar with systemd service ?
11:41 < stevendale> No but I am familiar with the Windows Update service RevanOne... Jk jk xD
11:42 < stevendale> RevanOne: Ask your question and if somebody has the knowledge to help you, they will :)
11:47 < jim> RevanOne, yep, just ask... also throw in lots of informative details
12:01 < za1b1tsu> just found out about kde connect, are there any other tools that I should be aware of as a linux and android user?
12:03 < revel> za1b1tsu: Termux is pretty neat. I can copy clipboard content and files with it + ssh/scp.
12:03 < revel> With xclip for Linux and termux-clipboard-{g,s}et on Termux since it accesses the Android clipboard contents.
12:04 < Triffid_Hunter> oiaohm: granted, and have you checked the socat manpage recently? ;)
12:05 < za1b1tsu> revel, that's sound really cool
12:05 < popnfloss> i use termius for ssh on android
12:05 < popnfloss> i havent tried termux so idk if its better than that one
12:06 < revel> It's more-or-less a full Linux-y environment with openssh, a shell and all that other good stuff.
12:06 < revel> Plus some stuff to interface with Android-y stuff like to check battery level/charge status, send notifications, send and view SMS messages etc.
12:07 < za1b1tsu> revel on your android do you a use a more complete keyboard with ctrl, super, alt etc?
12:08 < revel> za1b1tsu: No, though in the Termux app, if you hold the volume up key, it acts as alt, and if you hold volume down, it acts as ctrl.
12:08 < revel> Plus volup-1=f1 and some other stuff.
12:09 < revel> Though if I'm accessing it via ssh from a desktop anyway, it doesn't matter.
12:09 < za1b1tsu> damn, my volume down button is kinda f'ed up.
12:10 < revel> I think volume-up+q also shows an additional bar with ctrl/alt/some other keys.
12:10 < revel> esc,ctrl,alt,tab,-,/,|
12:12 < za1b1tsu> revel cheers
12:13 < revel> I think this isn't too horribly off-topic on ##linux since it's for GNU/Linux stuff and Termux has GNU utils + Android's kernel is Linux-ish.
12:13  * tomty89 is on Termux now
12:14 < tomty89> It's Linux. Just not mainline.
12:15 < revel> I think the userspace is the main difference.
12:15 < RevanOne> I have added MemoryMax and MemoryHigh in my service  in systemd
12:15 < RevanOne> but I get this  Unknown lvalue 'MemoryHigh' in section 'Service'
12:15 < RevanOne> ubuntu 16.04
12:15 < RevanOne> why ?
12:16 < Triffid_Hunter> revel: heh I wrote a little shell script on my phone for dumping SMSes from the sqlite store
12:16 < tomty89> revel: well Termux makes use of bionic libc, that's the biggest twist I guess
12:16 < revel> Triffid_Hunter: That probably requires root.
12:16 < revel> tomty89: And some people use musl.
12:17 < tomty89> Heh
12:19 < Triffid_Hunter> revel: well sure, but it's not like I'd be carrying around a linux machine I don't have root on :P
12:19 < revel> I have root as well, though this solution doesn't require root and, bonus, dumps it as json.
12:23 < jackp10> hi to everyone
12:24 < jackp10> can someone please help me? I don't know what else to do. I found a corrupted db and I tried to remove it but I I ran into a problem I cannot solve
12:24 < jackp10> I am on Ubuntu 14.04 and I receive the following error "dpkg: error processing package mysql-server (--configure):"
12:24 < jackp10> I was trying to remove mysql packages and reinstall them
12:24 < jackp10> but I hit that roadblock and I don't know what to do
12:30 < Bunk> o/
12:32 < Exagone313> Hi, I'm compiling 4.17-rc4 with gcc 8.1 and I get a lot of warnings that I didn't have with gcc 7 with previous linux builds, such as:  "objtool: ...: sibling call from callable instruction with modified stack frame"  plus some warnings added by gcc 8 but they don't matter.  I'm wondering if the build is gonna be usable.  Any idea?  Thanks for your help.
12:34 < jim> 4.17... kernel?
12:35 < jim> warnings are usually harmless, but possibly warrant your attention if you're the one writing the code, and you want to fix it to make sure there aren't warnings...
12:36 < jim> as far as whether it'll work, no idea, probably it will
12:36 < revel> Newer GCCs tend to give off a lot more warnings.
12:36 < milp_2> hi, what is the best way of getting an equivalent to ntfs-compression in ubuntu - if i value storage space over performance?
12:37 < dgurney> Exagone313, I read from a mailing list message that that's a known issue, and that patches exist but need to be cleaned up before they can be applied to the tree
12:37 < jim> well ntfs is microsoft, and support for it seems to work, but is otherwise pretty experimental and reverse-engineered
12:37 < Exagone313> dgurney: is the build going to be usable?
12:38 < Exagone313> if I can just ignore warnings it's fine to me
12:38 < dgurney> dunno, try it
12:38 < jim> yeah it's not going to damage you to wait for the kernel build to complete
12:40 < revel> There's usually like 7 release candidates before a new .x release is released, right?
12:40 < dgurney> for what it's worth, Fedora 28 kernels are compiled with gcc 8, so it *should* work
12:40 < RevanOne> any idea why I get this Unknown lvalue 'MemoryHigh' in section 'Service' ? I am adding this config line in my service systemd, under ubuntu 16.04
12:40 < dgurney> revel, correct
12:41 < RevanOne> jim stevendale
12:41 < dgurney> with some particularly busy cycles there have even been 8 rcs
12:41 < revel> RevanOne: Maybe that was added in a later version of systemd?
12:41 < jim> well lvalue and rvalue is in an assignment, like: lvalue = rvalue;
12:42 < RevanOne> hmm ?
12:43 < jim> lvalue means "on the left side of the ="
12:43 < jim> so an lvelue basically signifies something that can be assigned a value (variable, array element, etc)
12:44 < tomty89> So there's no such thing as 'MemoryHigh'?
12:44 < eqw> Hello. This just prints "137": 'su -c ls orangepi; echo $?'. Any suggestions?
12:44 < jim> well you'
12:44 < jim> would hav to see what the definition of MemoryHigh is
12:45 < m00dy> What is OOM killer ?
12:45 < RevanOne> I tried with percent MemoryHigh=70%, I tried with number MemoryHigh=1g
12:45 < Triffid_Hunter> eqw: find out why ls is being kill-9ed?
12:45 < ][_R_][> m00dy: It's a kernel feature that kills processes that use too much memory.  OOM==Out Of Memory
12:45 < revel> I can see some manuals mentioning MemoryHigh, so I'm just guessing it's a valid lvalue, just not implemented in the version of systemd shipping with Ubuntu 16.04
12:45 < m00dy> ][_R_][: thanks
12:45 < BCMM> m00dy: if you use up all of your available virtual memory (RAM and swap), the linux kernel will have to kill a process to free up some memory
12:45 < eqw> Triffid_Hunter: how? Who can kill it so quickly?
12:46 < jim> m00dy, something in the background that looks for things to kill so that their memory can be freed
12:46 < RevanOne> according to this: https://www.freedesktop.org/software/systemd/man/systemd.resource-control.html
12:46 < tomty89> eqw: quote 'ls orangeapi; echo $?' (with single quotes probably, because of the variable)
12:46 < m00dy> hmm
12:46 < Triffid_Hunter> eqw: dunno, ask strace
12:46 < m00dy> Can I set its policy ?
12:46 < BCMM> m00dy: it will try to target a process that's using a lot of memory, but hasn't used much CPU time, to minimise lost work
12:46 < Triffid_Hunter> tomty89: "On success, su returns the exit value of the command it executed. If this command was terminated by a signal, su returns the number of this signal plus 128."
12:46 < jim> maybe, I've never tried
12:46 < BCMM> m00dy: yes
12:46 < BCMM> well, nevermind
12:47 < tomty89> eqw: or just quote 'ls orangeapi', depends on what you want to do
12:47 < tomty89> eqw: the rule is -c takes a single word
12:47 < eqw> i want to ls by user orangepi
12:48 < eqw> i want to know why i cannot login as orangepi
12:49 < tomty89> eqw: then it should be su orangeapi -c ls?
12:49 < tomty89> well maybe the order doesn't matter
12:51 < eqw> i usually use this order
12:51 < eqw> Triffid_Hunter: I'm not able to understand this: http://termbin.com/cjww
12:52 < JimBuntu> eqw, How about check out 'grep -i "orangepi" /etc/passwd` and verify it's a user that can login, as in, no '/sbin/nologin' for starters
12:52 < eqw> JimBuntu: this was my first try
13:02 < m00dy> sorry guys
13:03 < m00dy> I needed to kill my network stack in my kernel
13:04 < jim> sec
13:04 < Triffid_Hunter> eqw: looks like su throwing an error to some pipe, try strace with -s 1024
13:05 < jim> all I can see you might not have seen, is bcmm was probably about to post an answer, when you left
13:05 < Triffid_Hunter> eqw: right near the end, at this line --> send(3, "<86>May  8 10:50:07 su[3178]: pa"..., 84, MSG_NOSIGNAL) = 84 <-- it's spitting some sort of error, presumably didn't like the result of reading /etc/passwd
13:05 < BCMM> jim: thanks
13:06 < jim> BCMM, welcome, referring to m00dy
13:06 < BCMM> m00dy: weirdly, oracle has some pretty clear docs on this, though they could be a bit out of date. first on google for "configure oomkiller"
13:07 < m00dy> jim: thanks
13:07 < jim> welcome
13:07 < BCMM> m00dy: but basically you can indeed configure the oomkiller, for example exempting certain processes from it
13:07 < m00dy> yeap
13:07 < m00dy> like process name filtering
13:07 < m00dy> I will be googling that
13:07 < m00dy> meanwhile
13:08 < m00dy> I got another question which is about linux kernel
13:08 < Triffid_Hunter> can also tell linux to not over-commit ram so processes can fail gracefully when they ask for it rather than thinking they have it then being nuked when linux decides they don't
13:08 < BCMM> m00dy: (but in general, it's better to merely discourage the oomkiller from targeting a specific process)
13:09 < Triffid_Hunter> yeah, not much fun if the one process you've protected from oom-killer is the one going rogue
13:09 < m00dy> but how's oom killer work ?
13:09 < BCMM> m00dy: by setting oom_adj to a low value, but not to the minimum, the oom killer will basically *try* not to kill that process, but still *can* kill it if it needs to
13:10 < BCMM> m00dy: in short, any time somebody tries to allocate memory, but there's no memory left to allocate, the kernel kills a process
13:11 < BCMM> m00dy: looks like i dropped off the network for a moment there - if you said anything, i didn't see it
13:12 < BCMM> m00dy: in short, any time somebody tries to allocate memory, but there's no memory left to allocate, the kernel kills a process (sorry if this one has been seen already)
13:12 < m00dy> BCMM: I got it.
13:12 < m00dy> BCMM: I used to use Bouncer once upon a time
13:12 < kazdax> today is my birthday
13:12 < BCMM> jim: does this channel currently require users to identify with services?
13:12 < milp_2> hi, what is the best way of getting an equivalent to ntfs-compression in ubuntu - if i value storage space over performance?
13:12 < kazdax> what should i treat myself too
13:12 < kazdax> a new arch install on bare metal :)
13:12 < m00dy> c0ngr4tz kazdax
13:12 < kazdax> thanks
13:12 < m00dy> kazdax: panic your kernel. So it will now
13:12 < milp_2> kazdax: build a recent kernel ontop of a 486?
13:12 < m00dy> know*
13:13 < eqw> Triffid_Hunter: http://termbin.com/evqb
13:13 < jim> BCMM, in order to speak, yes
13:13 < BCMM> jim: thanks
13:14 < kazdax> i am thinking about learning about patterns ..specially the fibonacci as my investment into something..eventually i want to write pattern regcognision algorithms
13:14 < jim> welcome
13:14 < m00dy> I wanna build a system that sits between two other systems and It should be behave like a transparent proxy between these two machines in top 3 osi layers.
13:14 < m00dy> starting from network layer to app layer
13:14 < kazdax> i have to get my hands dirty with some mathemtics
13:14 < ||JD||> also with grammar
13:14 < Triffid_Hunter> eqw: wait4(-1, [{WIFSIGNALED(s) && WTERMSIG(s) == SIGKILL}], WSTOPPED, NULL) = 3204 <-- yep looks like it's getting killed
13:14 < kazdax> yes
13:15 < kazdax> i have beeen putting that one out for such a,long time
13:15 < kazdax> i dont realise that english is preety much like a computer language that has rulex and syntax uses
13:15 < BCMM> jim: (i asked because i had tyyyyyy PM me a question because he can't speak)
13:15 < kazdax> fire me up some khan acadmey
13:25 < eqw> Checking "/lib/modules/3.4.39/build/.config" failed with error: No such file or directory
13:26 < eqw> says stap. Do I missing some package?
13:29 < j0seph> eqw: you need to give us a lot more details. what distro / package manager are you using? what program / package are you attempting to install? what command are you trying to run?
13:30 < oiaohm> kazdax: English has rules and syntax???  I don't know what you have been reading.   Reality is every rule in English language has conditions when it is to be disobeyed.    Why because modern English was created a diplomatic language and over the years has mixed in features for about 20 languages and counting.
13:31 < SkunkyFone> and why on earth are you using such an old kernel.
13:31 < jack_rip_vim> oiaohm: you remain me my poor English at early
13:31 < eqw> j0seph: ubuntu xenial. I'm not trying to install, I'm trying to use stap script from https://www.ibm.com/developerworks/community/blogs/aimsupport/entry/Finding_the_source_of_signals_on_Linux_with_strace_auditd_or_Systemtap?lang=en
13:32 < j0seph> eqw: exact version + kernel ver. please?
13:32 < oiaohm> jack_rip_vim: My English is still better than Panglish subforms that are creeping into common English.
13:32 < j0seph> or is xenial strictly 16.04?
13:33 < eqw> not ubuntu xenial, sorry. It is raspbian: Linux orangepi 3.4.39 #20 SMP PREEMPT Thu Jul 14 14:20:44 CST 2016 armv7l GNU/Linux
13:33 < jack_rip_vim> oiaohm: I think I should keep learning
13:33 < jack_rip_vim> eqw orangepi~
13:33 < eqw> Raspbian GNU/Linux 7 (wheezy)
13:34 < jack_rip_vim> eqw, How is the chip? is that hot?
13:34 < jack_rip_vim> eqw, I remember it is Allwinner ARM  chip
13:34 < bsdnoob> guys I am trying to write a simple systemd timer
13:34 < bsdnoob> but it doesn't seem to work
13:34 < oiaohm> jack_rip_vim: I remember learning the old rule i after e except after c.   Was true when I learnt it.   15 years latter there were more words in the Dictionary breaking that rule than obeying it due to the words brought in from other languages into English.
13:35 < bsdnoob> I can't figure out why
13:35 < bsdnoob> because it doesn't gives any error
13:35 < bsdnoob> and systemctl list-timer --all shows that timer ran X seconds ago
13:35 < oiaohm> jack_rip_vim: opps i before e expect after c was the old rule.   Current its i after e except after c as the most likely to be correct.
13:35 < ||JD||> kazdax: maths are overrated in this world, I mean, if you can learn some, great, but most programmers don't need anything more fancy than a cross multiplication on their daily duties
13:35 < jack_rip_vim> oiaohm: English always learn from other languages
13:35 < bsdnoob> but I don't see result of that script
13:36 < eqw> jack_rep_vim: i can touch it for less than 5 seconds. So at least 60C i think
13:36 < eqw> even 3 seconds
13:36 < jack_rip_vim> eqw, hot baby chip
13:36 < oiaohm> jack_rip_vim: English is always being transfored by other languages.   Why its next to impossible to write English perfectly.
13:37 < BCMM> ||JD||: programmers don't need to actually *do* maths often. but they might need to *understand*, if only at a very high level, the maths they're asking the machine to do
13:37 < Rembo> Bebef: https://hastebin.com/riyikotamo.nginx
13:37 < BCMM> if they're in the small minority that actually use computers for computation, as opposed to exclusively for communication
13:37 < ||JD||> BCMM: in same cases, yes
13:38 < jack_rip_vim> oiaohm: yeah, but that is good part for English. At least, English is still moving
13:39 < Bebef> Rembo: Hm. I thought your issue might be SSL related, but your curl looks recent enough
13:40 < jack_rip_vim> eqw, If you need a PCB board with Allwinner, I can design one.
13:40 < Rembo> Bebef, what issue can be with curl?
13:41 < Bebef> Rembo: Yours?
13:43 < Rembo> Bebef: can this be usefull https://hastebin.com/aqizejafig.md ?
13:43 < Bebef> yeah, that's what I meant
13:44 < Bebef> Rembo: What Linux are you running?
13:45 < Rembo> Bebef: Debian GNU/Linux 9 \n \l
13:47 < stevenm> hey, how can I clear the screen *plus* all scrollback (accessible via shift+pgdn/pgup) on a real (e.g. connected via vga) tty? not a terminal.
13:47 < jack_rip_vim> reset command
13:49 < Bebef> Rembo: why are you using '-k'?
13:51 < Rembo> Bebef: without -k does the same: https://hastebin.com/umijifafob.md
13:52 < Bebef> Rembo: Could you try --tlsv1.2 please?
13:54 < Rembo> Bebef: https://hastebin.com/ivefumupat.md
13:55 < Bebef> Rembo: this is really strange. I really have no idea what's happening there. From my boxes everything looks OK
13:55 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, nope that doesn't work
13:56 < Rembo> Bebef, i think there is something with localhost or something
13:56 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: reset command didn't clean the screen?
13:57 < stevenm> no it did, but that wasn't the question :P  it didn't clear all the scrollback
13:57 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: I think you are using gnome terminal
13:57 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, and I *know* that I am not
13:57 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: what is your DE?
13:58 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, there is no DE on this server
13:58 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: if not DE, what is your way to scroll back tty?
13:58 < stevenm> I'm going to repeat the question as your answer is in there...
13:59 < stevenm> <stevenm> hey, how can I clear the screen *plus* all scrollback (accessible via shift+pgdn/pgup) on a real (e.g. connected via vga) tty? not a terminal.
14:00 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: reset, then try history -c
14:01 < stevenm> history isn't about scrollback
14:01 < stevenm> so no of course that hasn't worked
14:01 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: it will clean the command cache
14:01 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, sure it will - completely unrelated to what I've asked
14:01 < ananke> reboot
14:02 < Bebef> lol
14:02 < stevenm> ananke, :)
14:02 < section1> no
14:02 < section1> change to tty2 and back to tty1
14:02 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: try what I said
14:02 < section1> no more scrooll
14:02 < stevenm> section1, oh wow yeah - how simple is that!
14:02 < section1> :)
14:02 < stevenm> thanks section1
14:02 < section1> np
14:03 < milp_2> hi, what is the best way of getting an equivalent to ntfs-compression in ubuntu - if i value storage space over performance?
14:03 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, seriously - it'd help if you're helping others (nice that you try though, points for that) to actually read the (very contained) question
14:03 < milp_2> i saw fusecompress but it seems really old
14:03 < stevenm> rather than just second guess what the op is trying to do or their situation!
14:04 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: actually, I think ananke's suggestion is a good idea
14:04 < Rembo> Bebef, why sugestions?
14:04 < stevenm> I think (hope) that was intended to be joke :P
14:04 < jack_rip_vim> reboot fixed everything
14:05 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: if you want, you can try once what I said
14:06 < geirha> I assume logging out and back in is out of the question too? :)
14:06 < triceratux> stevenm: you could also write a script that echoes enough blank lines to the console that the recall buffer only returns blank lines. probably only need 100 or 500 or 1000 or 5000 or something
14:07 < stevenm> triceratux, thought of that but wanted a little less cludgey :)
14:07 < triceratux> even have it echo ~ like its vi or something
14:07 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, I already did before I realised that 'history' is completely unrelated to tty scrollback
14:07 < stevenm> geirha, actually that doesn't work either
14:07 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: it is related
14:07 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, it is *not*
14:07 < stevenm> section1's idea was golden though - so thanks again
14:08 < jack_rip_vim> not not
14:08 < stevenm> works brilliantly
14:08 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, https://ss64.com/bash/history.html
14:08 < stevenm> history -c   just clears your command history
14:08 < stevenm> I haven't mentioned *anything* about command history  -   YOU did
14:09 < rypervenche> stevenm: Log out and back in?
14:09 < stevenm> rypervenche, geirha already beat you to that suggestion - doesn't work
14:09 < stevenm> not sure why I'm still getting more suggestions though, this is solved... section1 solved it
14:09  * jack_rip_vim is thinking how to explain when with shift+pg up/pg down on tty, it read the history cache
14:10 < geirha> works for me, but that's probably some getty setting
14:10 < rypervenche> stevenm: No? Works for me.
14:11 < TaZeR> could someone help me write a simple script, its function being to detect if a certain bin file is running, and if it isnt then to run a command starting the program with options specified?
14:11 < geirha> jack_rip_vim: no really, the history command deals with readline's history. It's unrelated to whatever the tty is remembering
14:12 < TaZeR> so it can run as a cron job starting the program when needed
14:12 < stevenm> TaZeR, sounds like something more easily done with a systemd unit file
14:12 < jack_rip_vim> geirha: it is related, you can try history -c, it clean the history, when you type pg up/down, it can't scroll back
14:13 < ananke> TaZeR: pgrep
14:13 < TaZeR> im open to any suggestions on the best way to dothis
14:13 < geirha> jack_rip_vim: yeah, page up and page down browse through readline's history, that's true
14:13 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, I didn't say 'pg up/down'  ... I said.... 'shift+pgdn/pgup'
14:13 < geirha> but shift+page up and shift+page down is handled by the tty, not readline
14:13 < ananke> TaZeR: ohh, you want that thing to monitor itself? yeah, systemd unit file would be more appropriate
14:14 < triceratux> TaZeR: pidof $progname || $progname &
14:14 < TaZeR> is it easy to do? id have to read up on these systemd unit files first
14:14 < TaZeR> cause i had no idea how to write a script doing it
14:15 < rypervenche> TaZeR: Yeah, you should be handling it in your init system. (systemd most likely). It's very simple to do. Just a few lines in a file.
14:15 < TaZeR> will it only start at boot though? or anytime its detected as not running
14:15 < jack_rip_vim> geirha: stevenm: OK, I think there is no way to fix, expect login logout or reboot
14:15 < rypervenche> TaZeR: You can have it do both.
14:15 < stevenm> jack_rip_vim, it's already *SOLVED* like 13 minutes ago...
14:15 < jack_rip_vim> or change tty
14:15 < stevenm> <section1> change to tty2 and back to tty1
14:16 < geirha> (that is, page up and page down *may* browse through readline's history if you bind them to do so, and probably some distros do that by default)
14:16 < TaZeR> ok thanks ill look into it, if its too complicated to do ill come back for help :p
14:16 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: good, your question fixed
14:17 < triceratux> TaZeR: its not complicated at all. thats why they wrote systemd to make things like this easy ;)
14:17 < jack_rip_vim> stevenm: normally, I just use reset to clean the screen
14:17 < stevenm> someone get me a weapon
14:17 < TaZeR> triceratux: yea ive noticed, systemd has been a pleasure to work with so far
14:18 < jack_rip_vim> :~
14:18 < mtaxicl> hi, i have a query. can I access the tracepoints in the kernel module. I see my tracepoint is listed in /proc/kallsyms but I am not able to attach this event in the kernel module. any suggestions/references to it?
14:21 < section1> mtaxicl, do you export the tracepoints ?
14:21 < tyyyyyy> Is it possible to highlight labels in grub ??
14:22 < tyyyyyy> In a grub theme ??????/
14:25 < tyyyyyy> Any with knowledge ?
14:25 < tyyyyyy> Anyone*
14:26 < mawk> calm down
14:28  * jack_rip_vim 's knowledge has been run out by stevenm's question
14:29 < Bru-> Yarr! Guten morgen
14:30 < Bru-> anyone else have wifi issues on the new 4.15.0-20 kernel?
14:30 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: Guten morgen!
14:30 < tyyyyyy> Guten morgen
14:30 < Bru-> after updating the kernel, OS couldnt detect the intel wifi card or intel gfx
14:30 < Bru-> had to revert back to 4.15.0-15
14:30 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: I didn't have problem with wifi
14:31 < Bru-> jack_rip_vim: is yours an intel card or other?
14:31 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: I think the reason is my computer is old
14:31 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: Intel card
14:32 < Bru-> hmmm, this is on a 5-6 year old toughbook
14:32 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: no old enough, mine is ten years old
14:33 < dgurney> there shouldn't be such a problem such relatively modern hardware
14:33 < triceratux> Bru-: what distro ?
14:33 < dgurney> what distro is this?`you may have better luck on their support channelö
14:33 < dgurney> *channel
14:33 < Bru-> minty fresh
14:33 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: you didn't try Lubuntu or Xubuntu?
14:34 < jim> jack_rip_vim, are you having difficulty with a machine?
14:34 < Bru-> jack_rip_vim: not yet
14:34 < Bru-> im still cutting my teeth on linux. then im gonna try some others
14:35 < jack_rip_vim> jim: not, but I always use an ten years old computer to run new linux kernel
14:35 < tyyyyyy> Is it possible to invert a grub fonts ??
14:35 < tyyyyyy> I mean the colors ??
14:36 < BCMM> tyyyyyy: you managed to register!
14:36 < BCMM> tyyyyyy: a little advice about irc: i see you sent a greeting in #grub, and it looks like you're waiting for a reply
14:36 < jim> tyyyyyy, yeah, welcome to the frey
14:36 < BCMM> tyyyyyy: that might work in here, but #grub is a smaller channel with much lower traffic
14:36 < triceratux> tyyyyyy: personally i dont mess with that stuff but its thoroughly documented http://www.gnu.org/software/grub/manual/grub/html_node/Theme-file-format.html#Theme-file-format
14:37 < BCMM> tyyyyyy: on a channel like grub, you need to just ask your question, and then be prepared to wait. like, do something else and check back in a couple of hours
14:37 < BCMM> tyyyyyy: it might seem a bit rude to just jump straight in with a question, but on freenode that's normal
14:37 < jack_rip_vim> 64MB RAM for a LISP machine, is that enough for running it?
14:39 < jim> bcmm, as you know, we like it when they just ask :)
14:39 < jack_rip_vim> I remember, earlier, LISP computers just have 8MB RAM
14:40 < BCMM> jim: i may have been unclear - i was trying to explain that "just ask" is the norm on freenode, and not considered rude
14:40 < BCMM> in contrast, perhaps, to face-to-face human conversation
14:40 < jim> right, I see where you're going
14:41  * jack_rip_vim is thinking if Ateml ARM9 can fix what he needs.
14:42 < Bru-> imma try the new kernel on my cf-c1
14:43 < section1> Bru-, its a custom kernel ? do you check that the module its loaded?
14:44 < Bru-> negative
14:44 < asphyxia> Would anyone have any suggestions for how to speed my os up? I'm having to run it off a usb and it freezes all the time (usb type 2) esp. when I try running my IDE or more than a few tabs in firefox etc :(
14:45 < triceratux> Bru-: did you install the kernel upgrade from your distros repo ?
14:45 < mawk> usb type 2 ?
14:45 < section1> Bru-, check with lsmod if the module show up...i think that the intel module for wifi is iwlwifi
14:45 < dgurney> asphyxia, don't use it from a USB 2.0 device
14:45 < noodlepie> I have a custom kernel on my 4 core, 8 thread i7 laptop. Its running 4.16.7-gentoo stablely and has some nice features enabled, compiled for Core2/Xeon.
14:45 < dgurney> simple
14:45 < asphyxia> yeah not the blue ports :/
14:45 < asphyxia> dgurney: I don't have a choice in this case unfortunately
14:46 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: I am glade that you have good cpu to run gentoo, on my old computer, when I want to emerge something, it needs a lot of time
14:47 < mtaxicl> I have not explicitly exported it, but when I try to do so, I get an error saying that it cannot redeclare the tracepoint.
14:47 < dgurney> asphyxia, in that case you should move to at least a USB 3.1 gen1 (aka USB 3.0) storage device
14:48 < jack_rip_vim> s/glade/glad
14:48 < section1> mtaxicl, which tracepoint name ?
14:48 < section1> never i try to use trace points.
14:49 < section1> mtaxicl, maybe in kernel can help you better.
14:49 < section1> ##kernel
14:49 < asphyxia> dgurney: so in my case it's purely a hardware limitation and there's nothing I can really do about it then
14:49 < asphyxia> well that sucks
14:49 < mtaxicl> I have registered my tracepoint in x86/include/asm/trace/irq_vectors.h
14:50 < dgurney> yes. USB 2.0 really isn't fast enough for regular OS usage
14:50 < noodlepie> jack_rip_vim, yeah. that's why I use Debian on older machines. Binary pre-built packages are so convenient but the optimization Gentoo gives you is unique and very convenient. :P
14:50 < mtaxicl> section1, thanks, I will try there
14:50 < noodlepie> Great if you have the CPU power! :P
14:51 < section1> noodlepie, gentoo ft
14:51 < section1> w
14:51 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: I think I need to buy a power ARM Cortex-Ax CPU to set up a board, then try to run with Gentoo
14:52 < noodlepie> mine laptop, an i7 was custom built by box.co.uk and support Linux 100%, even the Free drviers for nvidia/intel works; console, X11, wayland and all that. Sounds works too and I can play MIDIs over USB to my Roland synth. It's DSP settings and effects controls are superb!
14:52  * jack_rip_vim is waiting for the register answer from Broadcom
14:53 < noodlepie> Sounds much better than Timidity++ can. 'Works it Rosegarded for MIDI sequencing. I collect Hardcore Rave MIDIS, and make them for personal criticism.
14:54 < Bru-> section1: yeah the new kernel sheds intel hardware
14:54 < Bru-> video and wifi
14:54 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: that sound great
14:55 < Bru-> sound as well
14:55 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: I guess you fixed the intel card problems
14:56 < noodlepie> If you can Sound Modell, this synth is the best. Its virtual analog, which means its digital but manipulates sound according to knobs and sliders which are analogue, and digited by the keyboard. You can control the whole lot from Linux. There's a neat Java app for controlling the synths waveforms, DSP, efffect and amplifiers too.
14:56 < Bru-> haha xD
14:56 < section1> Bru-, check the modules you have loaded now and with the new kernel...looks like are missing modules..
14:56 < section1> Bru-, the command is lsmod
14:56 < Bru-> section1: yes thats exactly it
14:56 < Bru-> missing wifi, sound, video
14:56 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: will figure out it
14:57 < triceratux> Bru-: did you rebuild the initrd to match the upgraded kernel ?
14:57 < section1> Bru-,  try to loaded by hand.. like modprobe iwlwifi
14:57 < Bru-> touchscreen doesnt work either
14:57 < Bru-> fiddlesticks
14:57 < Bru-> triceratux: negative
14:58 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: you have a touch screen too?
14:58 < Bru-> i know right?
14:58 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: my cf-t8 have a touchscreen
14:59 < noodlepie> section1, what do you mean... section1> noodlepie, gentoo ft
14:59 < noodlepie> <section1> w?? (:
14:59 < noodlepie> ft?
14:59 < noodlepie> w?
14:59 < Bru-> cf-c1 and cf-19 both do here
14:59 < dgurney> noodlepie, I think he meant to write "ftw"
15:00 < section1> noodlepie, gentoo for the win ! i use gentoo too..in a i7-6700K with plasma profile...
15:00 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: CF-c1 should be water protected
15:00 < Bru-> eh def not
15:00 < Bru-> cf-19 yes
15:00 < Bru-> those are heavy duty
15:00 < Bru-> cf-19 is the fully rugged
15:00 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: CF-c1 didn't have?
15:01 < Bru-> cf-c1 is just a lightweight laptop
15:01 < Bru-> theres some protection but the ports are open air
15:02 < Bru-> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/fTk0R7hG/irccloudcapture2067580304102930560.jpg
15:03 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: I guess I mess with others
15:04 < jack_rip_vim> Bru-: what is the CPU? is that I5-4U?
15:04 < section1> Bru-, don't find the modules... thats is a strange distro...
15:05 < jack_rip_vim> OH! it is I5-2520M.
15:06 < noodlepie> jack_rip_vim, I LOVE ARM. Leaned assembler on it at school. It's the cutest CPU ISA design by far and is dead speedy. I wrote a multitasking, windowed desktop 3d model viewer app for the Acorn machines (these invented ARM years ago and used the RISC chip in their own computers - which we had at school).
15:06 < PaulVern> Is there a way to run a process on ONLY physical cores? (not virtual ones)
15:06 < noodlepie> cpu affinity and masking setting of The Linux Kernel! @:P-~
15:07 < section1> what is a virtual core? HT?
15:07 < PaulVern> Yeah, by Ryzen (AMD)
15:07 < dgurney> an alternative would be to disable hyperthreading in bios, but the question is, why do you need to only use physical cores?
15:07 < PaulVern> so core 0 is physical, core 1 is virtual, 2 is physical, etc
15:07 < PaulVern> I can't disable HT in the bios
15:07 < PaulVern> (shitty Dell computer)
15:07 < section1> aamd don't use ht
15:07 < noodlepie> You can enable and disable individual CPU's with Linux, and bind irq (network card) to individual or groups of cpu). It called Affinity. :P
15:08 < PaulVern> yeah, it's called something else for AMD
15:08 < PaulVern> but I've got 6 cores 12 threads
15:08 < dgurney> it's named differently, but functions the same as ht (afaik anyway)
15:08 < PaulVern> every second core is virtual (I checked /proc/cpuinfo)
15:08 < Bru-> haha
15:08 < Bru-> so the kernel works
15:08 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: what is the num of the ARM chip?
15:08 < PaulVern> and yeah, I'm trying to run a wine app which will perform better on physical cores
15:08 < Bru-> had to install the linux-modules-extras package
15:08 < peetaur2> PaulVern: for n in {4..7}; do echo 0 > /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu${n}/online; done
15:09 < noodlepie> mine? oh something like ARM 2 or ARM 3, this was 25 years ago! (:
15:09 < PaulVern> wow! really?
15:09 < PaulVern> peetaur2: I can disable cores like that?
15:09 < triceratux> Bru-: always work thru the distros packagemanger
15:09 < noodlepie> Today I have ARM in all my mobiles. Running Linux/Adroid and GNU (GNURoot Debian).
15:10 < peetaur2> PaulVern: hopefully :)
15:10 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: 0_0, pretty old. kind of age things
15:10 < Bru-> triceratux: i was using the update manager in the distro
15:10 < noodlepie> I wrote the full screen model viewer to be controlled by the mouse, in 100% ARM-RISC assembler. It's really nice to program.(:
15:10 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: yeah
15:11 < peetaur2> PaulVern: oh but I put the wrong numbers...should be {8..15} on an r7 1700X ...not sure what you have or what variety there is
15:11 < PaulVern> Why does 'online' only exist for some cores?
15:11 < PaulVern> [paul@nihonium2 ~]$ ls /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/online
15:11 < PaulVern> ls: cannot access '/sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu0/online': No such file or directory
15:11 < PaulVern> [paul@nihonium2 ~]$ ls /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu1/online
15:11 < PaulVern> /sys/devices/system/cpu/cpu1/online
15:11 < peetaur2> PaulVern: you cant turn off cpu0...the kernel lives there or hardware interrupts or something go on there only
15:11 < PaulVern> Ah
15:12 < PaulVern> I have a Ryzen5 1600X btw
15:12 < peetaur2> so... 6 core + ht? then {6..11}
15:14 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie, do you have any suggestions about the ARM chip? recently, I am choosing an ARM chip to build my own computer board. I already have a look at TI, STM, ATMEL, NXP, Broadcom. I don't know which one is best for my own computer board.
15:15 < Bru-> hmm
15:15 < PaulVern> thanks for the help peetaur2
15:15 < PaulVern> I had no idea we could just turn off CPU cores
15:15 < Bru-> wonder why the kernel didnt grab all the fixins from the distro update mgr
15:15 < triceratux> Bru-: depends. what distro ?
15:15 < Bru-> mint 18.3
15:15 < triceratux> ah
15:16 < triceratux> manjaro is better than mint these days
15:16 < Bru-> i found the resolution from a couple of forum posts
15:16 < Bru-> guys having the same problem
15:16 < Bru-> extras pack fixed it
15:16 < Bru-> :D
15:16 < noodlepie> jack_rip_vim, I have Quallcom and MediaTek ARM CPUs in my phones
15:16 < peetaur2> PaulVern: no prob. and keep in mind they aren't really turned off, just not used by linux when offline
15:16 < za1b1tsu> can hibernate in linux be as efficient as is with osx?
15:17 < fub> I want to use a raw socket with a specific user-id (to test iptable rules based on user ids). How can I do this? When I use setuid/seteuid/setgid it does still use root as the raw socket uid.
15:17 < peetaur2> PaulVern: I think this feature is designed to be used on hot swapping CPU sockets...so you don't care about the CPU except that linux won't crash when you pull it :)
15:17 < dgurney> Bru-, gotta love unnecessary package splitting
15:17 < fub> I looked at security capabilities (CAP_NET_RAW), but they are not available on the target system. Any other idea?
15:17 < peetaur2> (and of course your desktop board does not support hot swapping CPUs)
15:17 < Bru-> dgurney: im definitely learning!
15:18 < dgurney> good
15:18 < Bru-> just started messing around with linux again a week or so ago
15:18 < PaulVern> peetaur2: should meet my requirement perfectly (getting more fps in zelda botw)
15:18 < Bru-> last time i messed with linux, mandrake was still the goto distro
15:18 < Bru-> lol
15:18 < PaulVern> are you sure it's 6-11 and not 1,3,5,7,9,11 to disable?
15:18 < peetaur2> fub: you used setcap, right?
15:18 < peetaur2> fub: and it's a binary, not a script?
15:18 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: both Quallcom and MediaTek are focus on phone market. I don't know if that is good for computer
15:18 < mawk> which linux version fub ?
15:18 < mawk> file capabilities aren't the same as process capabilities, I assume that just file caps are unavailable fub ?
15:19 < peetaur2> PaulVern: depends ... looking again at my ryzen 7 it seems your odd numbers idea is correct, but for a xeon I did this on the other day, it was the 2nd half
15:20 < mawk> you're root, you grant yourself the CAP_NET_RAW capability, you enable the SECBIT_KEEP_CAPS secure bit, and you transition to the desired user, fub
15:20 < noodlepie> ARM is ARM they just run.
15:20 < mawk> or you use ambiant capabilities if they're available
15:20 < peetaur2> PaulVern: look at grep -E "processor|physical id|core id|^$" /proc/cpuinfo
15:20 < jack_rip_vim> noodlepie: I think I will read Quallcom and MediaTek user manual and datasheet to see of that is OK
15:21 < peetaur2> physical id is the socket I guess
15:22 < peetaur2> PaulVern: here's the r7 1700x and an i7 5820K  https://bpaste.net/show/1971c755eb95
15:22 < peetaur2> "processor" is the $n in my script
15:23 < Jari--> hi !
15:23 < Jari--> whats up?
15:23 < nixfreak> Hello I have 200+ file names in a log and I would like to use egrep or grep -E in order to print out a range from 1-293
15:23 < jim> skylite
15:24 < nixfreak> so file_name_1 - 293
15:24 < peetaur2> nixfreak: example format? probably awk is better....   awk 'NR >= 1 && NR <= 293' filenamehere
15:24 < nixfreak> so I can do 10 at a time like file_name1[-9]
15:24 < peetaur2> NR is "number of record" aka line number
15:24 < Acheron> triceratux, what do you think gives manjaro the edge these days over mint?
15:24 < nixfreak> its a huge log file
15:25 < nixfreak> no clue on line number
15:25 < peetaur2> oh then I think you should pastebin a sample.... show input data, and expected output of script
15:25 < mawk> fub: use the cap_set_proc() libc call to ajust process capabilities, then use the secure bits to keep the capabilities after a setresuid/setresgid, then you're good
15:26 < PaulVern> strange that it's different on AMD vs Intel. Must just be the way linux interprets them?
15:27 < PaulVern> now I just have 6 real cores, like my old Phenom 1090T
15:27 < triceratux> Acheron: a combination of the AUR, clickbots, & an ever enlarging refugee community now being drawn from macos & BSD users who prefer an arch style approach to a windows clone imho
15:30 < likcoras> What is the "arch style approach"?
15:31 < Acheron> triceratux, thanks for that info, hadn;t used it in while
15:31 < fub> mawk: I tried this code: http://dpaste.com/1YQH5GK
15:32 < fub> the cap_set_file returns with the error "Operation not supported"
15:32 < mawk> set_file ?
15:32 < revel> triceratux: What's with all the hype over AUR?
15:32 < mawk> I said to not use file capabilities fub
15:32 < mawk> file caps aren't always supported
15:32 < fub> oh, I see, there is a difference
15:32 < mawk> yes
15:32 < mawk> file capabilities imply process capabilities when the file is executed
15:33 < mawk> but you can change your own process capabilities independantly of file caps
15:33 < mawk> you just need to have the CAP_SETPCAP capability ~= be root
15:33 < triceratux> "The philosophy of Arch, known as The Arch Way, focuses on simplicity and user centrality, rather than user friendliness." http://www.linuxandubuntu.com/home/arch-linux-take-your-linux-knowledge-to-next-level-review
15:34 < fub> how do I check if my root user has this capabilities?
15:34 < mawk> it has it
15:34 < mawk> root has every cap 99.999% of the time
15:34 < mawk> unless you're launching a service with systemd or something
15:34 < haps> nixfreak: you figure it out yet? I'd suggest,if you want zeros, grep file_name_00[1-9] <logfile>, then 0[1-9][0-9], then something like $(seq 100 294) inside a for
15:35 < likcoras> Huh
15:36 < triceratux> "AUR is clever. If you're from macOS and familiar with Homebrew, you will understand it: it feels like Casks and Formulas." http://www.akitaonrails.com/2017/01/10/arch-linux-best-distro-ever
15:36 < mawk> fub: what I do in my programs where I use proc caps is to grant myself every cap, set the keep caps secure bit, transition to the wanted user, then drop every cap except CAP_NET_RAW in mode +ep
15:37 < mawk> there are many libs to do it, the raw glibc call works as well (cap_set_proc), you can also use the raw syscall
15:37 < noodlepie> Arch, Mint and Scientific are desktop mods, best distributed as packages for other distributions, and are for poofs! :P Go Debian and Gentoo! Real distros! :P
15:37 < noodlepie> hehe
15:37 < haps> nixfreak: what do you know, for i in {001..201}; do grep file_name_$i <log>; stuff; done
15:37 < triceratux> but again, why bother ? http://wiki.pacbsd.org/index.php/PacBSD
15:38 < triceratux> youd just wind up running arch
15:38 < triceratux> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Arch_Linux#Principles & no mint rofl cant come close
15:38 < fub> okay, so a) grant own process CAP_NET_RAW, b) "set keeps caps secure bit", c) setresuid/setresgid d) raw socket
15:38 < fub> ^mawk
15:38 < mawk> your process already has cap_net_raw fub
15:39 < mawk> you're root at the beggining
15:39 < mawk> forget what I said at the beggining it was wrong
15:39 < dannylee> hi
15:39 < mawk> fub: 15:36:33 <mawk> fub: what I do in my programs where I use proc caps is to grant myself every cap, set the keep caps secure bit, transition to the wanted user, then drop every cap except CAP_NET_RAW in mode +ep
15:39 < mawk> that is the correct way
15:39 < triceratux> dannylee: you need zorin & fedora like you need a hole in the head
15:39 < jim> hi
15:39 < mawk> fub: start your program as root, set keep_caps, setresuid, drop every cap except CAP_NET_RAW
15:39 < mawk> let me try
15:40 < dannylee> ya your hacking my machine again
15:40 < jack_rip_vim> triceratux: dannylee: your two live together?
15:40 < mawk> yes dannylee
15:40 < dannylee> fedora 27 is really my G0D
15:41 < fub> mawk: I dont need to drop all that caps except CAP_NET_RAW, the only thing important for me is using a raw socket from a non-root user for a simple test, so I think its fine without dropping the caps.
15:41 < bipul> Is it possible to hack linux?
15:41 < fub> Im currently creating the socket as root, then using setresuid, then sending the socket, but with this way the sockets uid is still root
15:41 < dannylee> ya i get hack every day
15:41 < noodlepie> bipul,Do you mean to program or to crack?
15:41 < fub> but using keep caps and creating the socket after the setresuid sounds like a possibility
15:41 < mawk> fub: ok fub so just set keep_caps then use setresuid
15:41 < mawk> and you're good
15:42 < mawk> you'll keep every capability while not being root
15:42 < dannylee> but not my root
15:42 < fub> mawk: and create socket afterwards, right?
15:42 < bipul> dannylee, How?
15:42 < mawk> yes
15:42 < jack_rip_vim> bipul: I think yes
15:42 < mawk> fub: you set the secure bits using prctl()
15:42 < dannylee> if i knew i would stop it
15:42 < bipul> noodlepie, What you will crack?
15:42 < noodlepie> No, only to program and improve!
15:43 < bipul> I mean only program.
15:43 < mawk> fub: prctl(PR_SET_SECUREBITS, SECBIT_KEEP_CAPS);
15:43 < jack_rip_vim> Intel CPU is unfixable.
15:43 < bipul> jack_rip_vim, How?
15:43 < mawk> right before setresuid & setresgid
15:43 < triceratux> dannylee: fedora 28 lxqt ftw
15:43 < jack_rip_vim> bipul: there are always way
15:43 < bipul> dannylee, Hahah so you knew at least that your getting rooted every time? huh?
15:44 < noodlepie> I mean what did you mean by "hack linux"? Program for it, or break into a running one? This is "cracking", "hacking" is called programming.
15:44 < jack_rip_vim> bipul: if you have been hearing someone creak an android phone
15:44 < dannylee> ya ya fedora 28 might really be G0d..but ill just stick too fedora 27
15:44 < jack_rip_vim> s/creak/crack
15:44 < bipul> jack_rip_vim, What 're the ways? I would like to test my kernel.
15:44 < noodlepie> I know the other side of cracking, -- security.
15:45 < dannylee> i only had fedora 27 for just a few months
15:45 < dannylee> i`m not up grading
15:45 < jack_rip_vim> pittacus, hi
15:46 < Bru-> Fedora 20.5 M
15:46 < Bru-> M'Lady
15:46 < bipul> No, i just like to test my kernel 4.13.0-39. If i'm able to  root it or not.
15:47 < jack_rip_vim> bipul: you have the old kernel?
15:48 < triceratux> i thought i was just imagining this. but its true. macos & bsd veterans will be far more impressed with manjaro than windows veterans will be impressed with mint. its like "oh heres the software & the doc ill need to get this to work" vs "how come theres no 3rd party productivity apps installable on this thing still ?"
15:48 < bipul> jack_rip_vim, Yes i do have.
15:48 < notadeveloper> waiting for summit 2018
15:49 < notadeveloper> +it
15:49 < notadeveloper> tit
15:49 < notadeveloper> +=it
15:49 < jack_rip_vim> bipul: you can googling the page at Jan 2nd, keyword meldown
15:49 < bipul> I would like to conduct this https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Privilege_escalation on kernel 4.13.0
15:50 < notadeveloper> ok ok
15:50 < notadeveloper> skipping amd64.rpm
15:51 < notadeveloper> and going for x86_64.rpm
15:51 < notadeveloper> lol
15:51 < notadeveloper> why?
15:51 < notadeveloper> hope no hard feelings
15:51 < jack_rip_vim> notadeveloper: ?
15:51 < jack_rip_vim> who are you talking with?
15:51 < SkunkyFone> himself.
15:51 < notadeveloper> yeah
15:52 < fub> mawk: currently trying this, thanks.
15:52 < notadeveloper> ;)
15:52 < jack_rip_vim> I got a ctcp from pittacus
15:52 < fub> Do you know of a good method how to see which effective uid the sockets is using?
15:52 < fub> Because its not a listening socket, I'm not fast enough to catch it with "ss".
15:53 < mawk> can't you just leave it open and pause the process fub ?
15:54  * jack_rip_vim may be a bad guy, every time, when he meantion the word 'crack', he got CTCP
15:54 < Psi-Jack> ctcp is a standard part of IRC.
15:54 < bipul> If your getting CTCP means your the victim.
15:55 < revel> Psi-Jack: Why am I getting 3 VERSION responses from you?
15:55 < Psi-Jack> revel: The world may never know. :)
15:55 < mawk> but apart from that you can maybe use the netlink socket to poll for raw socket creations, and get the uid, fub
15:55 < jack_rip_vim> Psi-Jack: yes, but it always happened when i said 'crack'
15:55 < mawk> but it's pretty complicated
15:55 < Psi-Jack> revel: heh because I have 3 IRC clients connected.
15:55 < Psi-Jack> What about crack?
15:56 < revel> All with different kernels?
15:56 < Psi-Jack> revel: Likely, yes.
15:56 < revel> What's weird is that the clients seem to be Arch (according to the kernel version substring thingy) and the znc is on Debian. I thought you were a Fedora guy.
15:56 < Psi-Jack> revel: Desktop, Laptop, work Desktop. All arch based.
15:56 < ibalerio> hi guys, little question, I am trying to read mails from commandline, I have a big list, and dont remember how to scroll down the mail list
15:56 < Psi-Jack> I was.
15:57 < revel> Until... The incident?
15:57 < Psi-Jack> But you don't use Fedora for servers. :)
15:57  * jack_rip_vim won't said 'crack' anymore
15:57 < ibalerio> I am able to go one by one but I need to scroll the list down
15:57 < fub> mawk: where does SECBIT_KEEP_CAPS come from?
15:57 < Psi-Jack> revel: incident?
15:57 < fub> for the prctl() call
15:57 < jack_rip_vim> s/said/say
15:57 < revel> Just joking.
15:57 < mawk> <linux/securebits.h> fub
15:57 < bipul> Read the man page  ibalerio
15:57 < Psi-Jack> revel: I just wanted to try something new. LOL. i3+xfce, Fedora couldn't give it to me without pain.
15:57 < revel> Psi-Jack: You don't use Fedora for desktops or laptops either, clearly.
15:58 < Psi-Jack> Not anymore nope.
15:58 < Psi-Jack> And just to be fair, I gave Ubuntu 18.04 a looksie last night. And nope. Not ever happening.
15:59 < haps> Psi-Jack: void?
15:59 < Psi-Jack> I'd rather exist.
15:59 < BitShack> Hello
15:59 < mawk> fub: keep your raw socket open and look in /proc/net/raw no ?
15:59 < mawk> that works universally
15:59  * jack_rip_vim sigh~
15:59 < ibalerio> bipul: I am on it..
15:59 < BitShack> How would I use the serial port on my pc as a ssh terminal that I could connect another device to such as a laptop?
16:00 < Psi-Jack> I've never looked at void. I'll check it out in a VM later.
16:00 < Psi-Jack> Just to look, but I doubt I will like it.
16:00 < mawk> not ssh BitShack
16:00 < Psi-Jack> Oh, runit. Nope.
16:00 < mawk> you'd just launch getty on it
16:00 < Psi-Jack> Nevermind, not happening.
16:00 < mawk> there's a systemd service template for that
16:00 < haps> Psi-Jack: I'm a fan of it, but I've not touched arch in a long time
16:00 < Psi-Jack> If it's not got systemd, I don't want it.
16:00 < peetaur2> [Monday, July 14, 2014] [01:19:07 PM] <Psi-Jack>       I tried Arch out for servers a while back. I will NEVER use Arch ever again. Especially for a desktop OS.
16:00 < BitShack> mawk: will this work on damn small linux?
16:00  * peetaur2 is very surprised
16:00 < Psi-Jack> peetaur2: LOL
16:00 < haps> Psi-Jack: that's why I thought you might have an opinion that mattered to me :-) it sounds like we're equally picky
16:00 < BitShack> peetaur2: what do you think of tiny core linux?
16:01 < mawk> it probably won't have systemd BitShack but you'd just launch a getty on it manually or using whatever system this embedded system is using yes
16:01 < peetaur2> BitShack: I don't think of it, except when asked about it.
16:01 < Psi-Jack> haps: Yeah. I /want/ my systemd. I /use/ my systemd, heavily, and properly.
16:01 < haps> oh, if it's "not" got systemd.
16:01 < haps> heh
16:01  * haps misread that
16:01  * haps can't stand it
16:01 < Psi-Jack> So, no systemd, not happening for /me/. ;)
16:01 < BitShack> also, when I try to ssh into my DSL machine the password I set nevfer works for the user
16:01 < edd_lc> how can I see the terminal's default encoding?
16:01 < haps> I have to use rhel @work and systemd is the bane of my existence
16:01 < mawk> is the user root BitShack ?
16:01 < BitShack> No
16:02 < Psi-Jack> haps: Most people don't even have a valid reason to hate/dislike it.
16:02 < haps> well, to be fair, most people don't "use" it
16:02 < aaa___> i hate pi-jack :(
16:02 < Psi-Jack> Once you learn systemd, you just don't want to go back.
16:02 < peetaur2> they don't *directly* use it
16:02 < Psi-Jack> aaa___: Seriously. Stop it. Nobody cares what you feel.
16:02 < haps> but it really slows down the shutdown process, fors tarts.
16:02 < haps> for starts
16:02 < mawk> for tarts
16:02 < BitShack> But then when I run passwd on the machine and set the password again, it says that i tried to set the password that was already set...
16:02 < peetaur2> and once I learned of all the problems on my machine being systemd's fault, you're right...I don't want to go back :P
16:02 < aaa___> nobody care what i fell ???? :'(
16:02 < haps> anyway, no matter
16:03 < Psi-Jack> haps: Actually, it speeds it up.
16:03 < haps> no it doesn't
16:03 < revel> Psi-Jack: I hated having to `systemctl restart-daemon` or whatever every time I change a config somewhere. I hated being unable to do that and having to reboot even more on a device with around 256MB of RAM.
16:03 < mawk> keyboard layout issues BitShack ?
16:03 < BitShack> No
16:03 < aaa___> someone care about me or no guys ? :'(
16:03 < Psi-Jack> revel: So, laziness
16:03 < haps> shutdown on rhel is super slow
16:03 < mawk> no aaa___
16:03 < revel> Since `systemctl daemon-reload` or whatever just straight-up said "pls get more RAM"
16:03 < haps> aaa___: I care.
16:03 < peetaur2> revel: heh yeah that's super annoying...it even knows it needs a reload because it nags you when you restart before daemon-reload
16:03 < revel> Psi-Jack: Well, no, I'd rather not restart my device every time I change a config...
16:03 < aaa___> thanks haps :D
16:03 < fub> mawk: after using setreuid() to a non-root user, creating the raw socket fails (I usually get this error message when I do not have the permission to create a raw socket)
16:03 < Psi-Jack> revel: daemon-reload is not that hard. :)
16:04 < aaa___> see haps care
16:04 < revel> Psi-Jack: Did you not read the second part?
16:04 < mawk> fub: let me try
16:04 < aaa___> I love haps and hate pi-jack now
16:04 < BitShack> Thank god I'm not using tiny core, that won't seem to ever work how you want it
16:04 < fub> okay
16:04 < triceratux> Psi-Jack: ExtonOS 18.4 lxqt ? its a debian boot with debian accounts, systemd, lxqt 0.12.0, & ubuntu 18.04 packages. plus mtp works in pcmanfm-qt (which it doesnt in F28) & the bdfl hasnt disappeared mysteriously yet http://www.extix.se/?p=393
16:04 < revel> It just flat-out hates you for not having a gigabyte of RAM or something.
16:04 < triceratux> thats always a plus
16:04 < Psi-Jack> revel: Second part I don't get. I run VM's with 256MB RAM, and have no issues.
16:04 < fub> mawk: Im currently executing this with sudo: prctl(PR_SET_SECUREBITS, SECBIT_KEEP_CAPS); setreuid(..); socket(..)
16:04 < BitShack> So what can I do since keyboard layout isn't my problem
16:04 < revel> Hmm, wait. I think it was more like 128MB.
16:05 < Psi-Jack> revel: 128MB, maybe. 256, definitely not an issue.
16:05 < Psi-Jack> And I stress MAYBE
16:05 < revel> I think it was 256MB necessary to do something I wanted to do, but couldn't.
16:05 < revel> The machine died anyway.
16:05 < Psi-Jack> And, well, I have a doctor's appointment to get to, so I have to cut this short.
16:05 < peetaur2> we used to run our dns servers with something like 80 MB of RAM...now post-systemd apocalypse, we run them with 512 MB
16:06 < BitShack> oi
16:06 < mawk> do you do an execve between the prctl and the socket creation fub ?
16:06 < mawk> oh ok
16:06 < mawk> let me try what you did then
16:06 < triceratux> swagarch ftw. still cant wrap my mind around i3 tho
16:06 < Psi-Jack> peetaur2: heh. DNS caches, so not giving it enough RAM to cache is just being a sadist. :)
16:06  * triceratux is a n00b
16:06 < BitShack> What is with all the ping timeouts
16:06 < mawk> do you check the return value of prctl fub ?
16:07 < mawk> you may lack the necessary capabilities, what I usually do is grant myself every cap before everything
16:07 < mawk> some caps might be dormant
16:07 < mawk> in the permitted set but not the effective set
16:07 < BitShack> ???
16:07 < BitShack> mawk: I was able to login when I first setup ssh
16:07 < BitShack> A reboot then didn't allow me to login
16:08 < BitShack> Even when the password was correct
16:08 < fub> mawk: no execve, its the same process
16:08 < fub> mawk: no, let me check prctl
16:10 < fub> mawk: prtcl() returns 0
16:10 < mawk> you're root at the beggining right ?
16:10 < mawk> when I try on my machine it works
16:10 < BitShack> Idk?
16:11 < BitShack> mawk are you talking DSL?
16:11 < BitShack> Or a dfferent distro?
16:11 < fub> mawk: yeah, Im running with sudo
16:12 < mawk> strange
16:12 < fub> let me print the current caps, one second
16:12 < mawk> I have CAP_NET_RAW after the setresuid in my test program
16:13 < mawk> http://paste.suut.in/RdqQsqkr.cpp
16:13 < xdexter> Hello, i need run a shell command with multi lines passed trought a variable, it's possible?
16:14 < ayecee> probably yes
16:14 < ayecee> but it's probably not a very good way of doing it
16:15 < xdexter> i created "https://pastebin.com/Re2MKR1f", but when i run the script i have "command not found"
16:15 < xdexter> hmm why?
16:15 < fub> mawk: so before using setreuid() and after I have cap_net_raw
16:15 < mawk> yeah that's what you need
16:15 < fub> but my setsockopt still fails, thats strange.
16:15 < ayecee> xdexter: what's the rest of the error?
16:15 < fub> TCP Error setting IP_HDRINCL. Error number : 9 . Error message : Bad file descriptor
16:16 < mawk> hm
16:16 < fub>     if (setsockopt (s_tcp, IPPROTO_IP, IP_HDRINCL, val_tcp, sizeof (one_tcp)) < 0)
16:16 < mawk> what about the socket call ?
16:16 < fub> this is what I am using
16:16 < fub> s_tcp = socket (AF_INET, SOCK_RAW , IPPROTO_TCP);
16:16 < mawk> what's the value of s_tcp ?
16:16 < xdexter> ayecee, "teste.sh: linha 10: git remote -v: comando não encontrado
16:16 < xdexter> "
16:16 < mawk> I guess -1, what is errno ?
16:16 < fub> yeah -1, one moment for errno
16:17 < ayecee> xdexter: it's treating the whole thing (git remote -v) as a command to find.
16:17 < ayecee> try without the quotes around "$COMMAND"
16:18 < mawk> probably EPERM
16:18 < ayecee> might have to reset IFS in the loop too.
16:18 < xdexter> ayecee, https://pastebin.com/1pLL50j5
16:18 < tyyyyyy> Does ms windows 7 use segoe ui in Windows Boot Manager ??
16:18 < mawk> let me try opening a raw socket on my side too
16:18 < fub> mawk: Operation not permitted
16:19 < mawk> yeah, EPERM
16:19 < mawk> strange
16:19 < mawk> it should pick up the CAP_NET_RAW
16:19 < BluesKaj> Hey folks
16:19 < ayecee> xdexter: where is COMMAND set?
16:19 < notadeveloper> matlab is gonna rock on java dev conference
16:19 < fub> mawk: do I also need setregid? Im currently using setreuid
16:20 < mawk> no fub , it was just for completeness
16:20 < tyyyyyy> I meant the font
16:20 < fub> mawk: ok
16:20 < notadeveloper> insights on big data
16:20 < notadeveloper> omg
16:20 < xdexter> ayecee, https://pastebin.com/RNt7c8ix works!
16:20 < ayecee> \o/
16:20 < mawk> yeah I get EPERM too
16:20 < solidfox> intel management engine can't be used if you don't punch holes in your firewalls right?
16:20 < mawk> let me try something
16:20 < fub> okay
16:20 < solidfox> I wonder if there is an intel channel
16:21 < xdexter> ayecee, thank you man
16:22 < geirha> at least use an array
16:22 < geirha> and you'll probably need eval
16:23 < mawk> ok fub
16:23 < mawk> you need to use SECBIT_NO_SETUID_FIXUP instead of the keep caps
16:23 < mawk> keep caps is weaker than no_setuid_fixup
16:23 < mawk> then it works
16:25 < mawk> if you use only keep_caps it doesn't keep the capability in the inheritable set, and for an unknown reason socket() doesn't like that
16:25 < mawk> it wants the capability in every set
16:25 < mawk> which is somewhat dumb but ok
16:26 < fub> mawk: works! wow thanks :)
16:27 < fub> let me try to understand this
16:28 < mawk> actually my explanation is false, even with no_setuid_fixup the inheritable caps are withdrawn
16:28 < mawk> maybe the glibc call does some magic and lose the capability somehow
16:29 < mawk> the description of no_setuid_fixup is in capabilities(7)
16:31 < fub> ok, I will read this. thanks a lot for your help!
16:31 < mawk> ok no I got it, using keep_caps will make every capability permitted, but not effective
16:31 < mawk> that's the trick
16:32 < mawk> you can use keep_caps if you want, but then you have to set CAP_NET_RAW as effective
16:33 < mawk> yeah that thing works
16:34 < fub> so what I compared with before&after the prctl() with keep_caps were only the possible caps, not the "used" ones?
16:34 < mawk> yeah probably
16:34 < mawk> the permitted capabilities, and not the effective capabilities
16:35 < fub> okay
16:35 < mawk> there are effective caps, permitted caps, inheritable caps, bounding caps, ambient caps
16:35 < fub> so when using keep_caps, how do you set an effective cap?
16:35 < fub> wow, sounds complicated :>
16:35 < mawk> yeah
16:35 < mawk> lol
16:35 < mawk> I made my own C++ lib to do it
16:35 < mawk> it uses the raw syscall, but you can use the libc to do it
16:35 < mawk> it's cap_set_proc() I guess
16:36 < mawk> I believe you'd do some magic to turn "cap_net_raw+e" into a cap_t value, then apply it with cap_set_proc()
16:37 < fub> ok, I will keep the current method for now because it works, but will experiment with it later.
16:37 < mawk> alright
16:37 < fub> mawk: thanks again, this really helped me today!
16:37 < mawk> you're welcome !
16:38 < mawk> then fub keep the raw socket open using a pause() or a sleep(85903809580954) call, then see in /proc/net/raw the UID
16:39 < mawk> it works on my side, I see UID 1000
16:39 < mawk> success
16:41 < fub> yes, same here :) awesome
16:49 < frwlkkaw> hey
16:50 < setuid> Has anyone ever seen a case where 'touch' on a file that doesn't exist yet, claims "No such file or directory"?
16:50 < setuid> # touch file.txt
16:50 < setuid> touch: cannot touch 'file.txt': No such file or directory
16:51 < connorburt> Anyone here familiar with how to fix a boot loader?
16:51 < BCMM> setuid: usually that would mean the directory you're trying to put it in doesn't exist
16:51 < nai> maybe you're in a directory that doesn't exist anymore
16:51 < fryguy> are you in a directory that exists?  does the file already exist and is potentially a non-existent symlink?
16:51 < ][_R_][> connorburt: just ask
16:51 < BCMM> setuid: it *is* possible for your CWD to not exist, if it was deleted after you cd'ed to it for example
16:51 < setuid> BCMM: I'm in that directory, currently $PWD, and I I can ls and see files sin there
16:52 < setuid> BCMM: It's a network mount, sshfs
16:52 < connorburt> My drive works perfectly fine, it's just not booting anymore
16:52 < connorburt> UEFI and efibootmgr I believe
16:52 < frwlkkaw> i found out what was consuming all cpu in linux on some webpages its a CSS animation Property with infinite, anyone knows why linux cant handle this ?
16:52 < BCMM> setuid: hmmm. if you open a new shell, can you still cd to it?
16:52 < setuid> BCMM: Yep
16:52 < uplime> frwlkkaw: I doubt its linux. its probably a bug in your browser or DE
16:52 < BCMM> frwlkkaw: sounds like an issue with your browser. the operating system is not responsible for rendering CSS
16:52 < ][_R_][> Or video driver
16:53 < uplime> yeah or that
16:53 < setuid> fuse.sshfs (rw,nosuid,nodev,relatime,user_id=0,group_id=0,allow_other)
16:53 < uplime> BCMM: well not directly at least
16:53 < setuid> It "should" let me write files there
16:53 < frwlkkaw> uplime: its linux i speak with people here yesterday and they had the same issue or please look at this page https://atom.io/
16:54 < frwlkkaw> look at cpu usage and then remove the css property
16:54 < uplime> frwlkkaw: I'm not on a linux machine, and it might be an issue with the linux *build* of the browser, but i highly doubt its the kernel itself
16:54 < frwlkkaw> someone confirm it
16:54 < uplime> if someone confirms it, it doesn't change anything we have said
16:55 < BCMM> frwlkkaw: what browser are you using?
16:55 < connorburt> I remember fiddling with efibootmgr a long time back and I think I might have removed the config
16:55 < connorburt> (I know I know)
16:55 < frwlkkaw> uplime: i changed browser it happens others
16:55 < frwlkkaw> chrome firefox
16:55 < frwlkkaw> opera
16:55  * uplime sighs
16:56 < BCMM> frwlkkaw: i'm getting like 3% CPU usage on that page, with Firefox 59.0.2
16:56 < setuid> very very fishy
16:56 < frwlkkaw> BCMM: on ubuntu?
16:56 < BCMM> frwlkkaw: but if several browsers are doing that, it sounds like maybe you don't have any hardware accelleration
16:56 < BCMM> frwlkkaw: debian sid
16:56 < BCMM> frwlkkaw: what sort of graphics device do you have?
16:56 < fryguy> that pages maxes out one of my cores
16:56 < fryguy> using proprietary nvidia drivers
16:57 < BCMM> fryguy: huh, interesting...
16:57 < frwlkkaw> BCMM: its because of virtualbox emulation then
16:57 < fryguy> BCMM: if you have any suggestions, that'd be sweet, i've seen this behavior on other pages too, but my machine is big enough that I just generally don't care
16:58 < frwlkkaw> i dont know but something is happening
16:59 < setuid> BCMM: I can sftp and put files on the remote, using the same SSH key that I'm using to (successfully) authenticate and mount it via sshfs, but when it's mounted, I can't write files into the mounted path .
17:00 < frwlkkaw> i just tested on another debian based linux in virtualbox and dont do the same behavior
17:01 < BCMM> fryguy: what browser and version?
17:01 < fryguy> chromium 66.0.3359.139
17:01 < BCMM> fryguy: firefox is giving me slightly-less-than-smooth animation there, as if it's throttling FPS deliberately
17:01 < fryguy> i see similar high cpu usage on youtube and stuff too. something is probably misset, but I'm not sure what
17:02 < frwlkkaw> my youtube is working good, its just when that css property appears
17:03 < ||JD||> frwlkkaw: what css property?
17:03 < frwlkkaw> ||JD||: CSS animation Property with infinite
17:04 < frwlkkaw> ||JD||: on ubuntu 18.04 and linux mint last version
17:05 < BCMM> frwlkkaw: are you using guest additions?
17:05 < frwlkkaw> ||JD||: but not on kali linux debian based aswell all on lastest virtualbox with guess additions installed
17:08 < frwlkkaw> is it just bad CSS code?
17:09 < ||JD||> probably, their IDE is terrible so
17:10 < frwlkkaw> https://www.w3schools.com/cssref/tryit.asp?filename=trycss3_animation
17:10 < frwlkkaw> just this uses alot of cpu
17:11 < BCMM> i mean, the primary purpose of Atom is to make computers spend more CPU time rendering CSS, right?
17:13 < ||JD||> frwlkkaw: I think animation is supposed to be CPU intensive when overused
17:14 < frwlkkaw> ||JD||: it doesnt do anything special on windows or my other linux, am going to try firefox esr
17:19 < frwlkkaw> same thing on firefox esr that am using on the other distro, its ubuntu issue i guess
17:20 < n-iCe> what issue
17:20 < n-iCe> I'm trying Ubuntu right now, can confirm you any bug.
17:21 < frwlkkaw> n-iCe: open this page https://www.w3schools.com/cssref/tryit.asp?filename=trycss3_animation
17:21 < frwlkkaw> n-iCe: tell me the cpu usage
17:22 < dreadkopp> hey guys. i made a extremely simple systemd service... when i run the command locally all is fine, however run as a service it fails ? https://hastebin.com/jewahuxazi.rb
17:23 < ayecee> maybe capture the error message it produces
17:23 < n-iCe> frwlkkaw: 13-15%
17:24 < frwlkkaw> n-iCe: what cpu do u have? browser? on ubuntu 18.04?
17:25 < n35xdxb0> i have a hard drive with ubuntu installed on it tht i had in an old laptop. is there a way of booting this hard drive into a virtualbox or something similar on my main laptop, so i can make changes to it etc?
17:27 < freeone3000> Hi. Interesting issue. So I can curl http://localhost:3476 . My `hostname` is foobar. If I try curl http://foobar:3476 I get "No route to host". Any clues?
17:29 < HelloFriend> can someone tell me what this command is doing?   find /home -exec grep -l date {} \;
17:29 < AndroidKitKat> if anyone is curious, opening your dotfiles in libre office breaks things
17:30 < nai> HelloFriend: lists all files in /home (recursively) in which "date" appears anywhere
17:30 < nai> pretty weird not to use grep -r for that
17:32 < HelloFriend> yeah just seen it online. so it doesn't give dates for directories right?
17:32 < HelloFriend> do dir get timestamped at all?
17:33 < Pizzarabe> it uses the string "date" there is no subshell or var involved
17:33 < Pizzarabe> what timestamp are you interested in ?
17:33 < HelloFriend> creation date
17:34 < n-iCe> freeone3000: chromium elitebook 840 18,04
17:34 < uplime> HelloFriend: most filesystems don't store the creation date. just the last modified date
17:34 < HelloFriend> ok i'll have to rethink this
17:35 < uplime> what is it  you're looking to do
17:38 < samort7> I'm having some trouble doing an SSH tunnel with my .ssh/config file. I'm trying to connect through a jump box to the machine, but keep getting a "getpeername failed: Bad file descriptor" error. Here's my config: https://codeshare.io/aYBXOL
17:39 < HelloFriend> uplime i was hoping to know when the directories were originally created. guess i can go by file creation which should be close enough. found this stat command that shows the birth time of files
17:41 < HelloFriend> thanks though, ttyl
17:44 < yakiza> HEllo guys i am currently learning bash and i am hoping you could tell me what are the usual automations a sys admin will do
17:45 < djph> yakiza: whatever they need to do to make their job easier.
17:45 < uplime> theres not really "usual automtions"
17:45 < djph> ^
17:45 < uplime> its just, hmm this has to be done manually quite often. lets automate it
17:46 < BCMM> come to think of it, any automation that's "usual" is probably already done by default
17:46 < gnulligan> At what point do I add the overlay if I'm doing a gentoo musl install?
17:46 < gnulligan> right before emerge -uvNDq world?
17:46 < gnulligan> or is it before emerge-webrsync?
17:46 < uplime> BCMM: exactly
17:46 < gnulligan> nvm #gentoo answered xD
17:48 < yakiza> FFS
17:48 < yakiza> GUYS
17:53 < djph> yakiza: hmm? what's with the yelling?
17:55 < ||JD||> yakiza: backups generation is an obvious one
17:56 < ||JD||> log rotation too, but it is already included in most deamons
17:57 < yakiza> djph:  well man honestly i knew i would get an answer like that from some of you... i know that  they will automate what they need etc but i am obv not experienced in a job like that so i asked to give me a suggestion for kind of ordinary things a sys admin would automate
17:57 < djph> yakiza: again "it depends"
17:57 < yakiza> ||JD||:  thanks
17:57 < yakiza> djph:  i know but i dont really care i would much more appretiate telling me automate an account creation or something like this random
17:58 < yakiza>  i just want to do silly simple stuff work up and learn to do more complex stuff
17:58 < djph> yakiza: the point is what *I* automate may be entirely different from what ||JD|| or uplime or anyone else in the channel automates.
17:58 < yakiza>  you understand what i mean? djph
17:58 < yakiza> djph:  you dont get my point
17:58 < djph> and that the "general" stuff (logrotate, as an example) is "generally" already handled
17:59 < yakiza> djph:  i dont care just give me an example i dont care i just want to get my haands dirty thats what i mean
17:59 < yakiza> djph:  then tell me something you have automated in the past or something you heard someone automated  the things you tell me i already know
18:00 < uplime> yakiza: i don't understand why you aren't getting this
18:00 < uplime> its not a secret
18:00 < uplime> i automated deploying certificates to a bunch of servers. someone else in here might or might not have done it
18:00 < BCMM> I am not certain this is a homework question
18:00 < widp> my usb 3.0 ports stopped working.
18:00 < BCMM> ^now certain
18:00 < widp> How do I go about fixing this?
18:00 < yakiza> BCMM:  it is not
18:00 < uplime> we don't all get together and compare notes on what we're automating. its just situational
18:00 < djph> logrotate is the big one.  users are so few and far between, "adduser" is fine, backups ... err, maybe? IDK, those have been in place so long IDK if it was me, or a third-party program anymore
18:00 < uplime> find something you don't like doing by hand and automate it
18:01 < BCMM> i have just automated transcoding music to Opus and transferring it to my phone over ssh
18:01 < BCMM> in case you can't tell, not a sysadmin
18:01 < djph> new VM provisioning is one I *should* probably do, but ... ehh, I do that so often (read - never) ...
18:02 < widp> I tried lsusb , but that seems to list the 3.0 "root hub"
18:02 < yakiza> uplime:  djph  BCMM  Maybe i cannot word properly what i want, since english is not my first language. i work  so its not a homework i am learning bash and i figure ill come here ask you guys for  a suggestion on what i could automate just a suggestion of something
18:02 < uplime> yakiza: we understand your question
18:02 < yakiza> BCMM:  THAT is a great answer
18:02 < widp> but not the devices connected to those ports.
18:02 < BCMM> yakiza: what was the last thing that annoyed you about your computer?
18:02 < yakiza>  i would really much appretiate that answer
18:02 < BCMM> yakiza: the task that made you think "this is taking way too much of my time"?
18:03 < djph> yakiza: find something YOU hate doing by hand, and then AUTOMATE IT.
18:03 < yakiza> BCMM:  well i move my hardrive from my office computer to my house and the interface is diferent so i jhave to use 2 diferent rc.firewall files
18:03 < djph> yakiza: I mean, if you don't transcode music and cp it to your phone, bccm's tool is pointless.
18:04 < yakiza> djph: i know but i dont care doing something usefull i just want to get my hands dirty to just learn
18:04 < yakiza> i found this page
18:04 < yakiza> https://www.serverwatch.com/trends/article.php/3908326/10-System-Administrator-Tasks-Ripe-for-Automation.htm
18:04 < triceratux> ive automated ensuring dnsmasq is properly intalled & not conflicting with systemd-resolved & is started on a handful of distros with differing strategies for dns resolution & services management
18:05 < toothe> what the?
18:05 < djph> triceratux: I did that too - went to sysvinit
18:05 < toothe> why was my name not toothe?
18:05 < BCMM> yakiza: sounds like you could have an systemd thingy that checks the MAC address of the network device on boot
18:06 < BCMM> and applies appropriate firewall rules for that device
18:07 < triceratux> djph: bwahahaha way too much work. as a sysadmin id rather write a series of automated scripts which blow holes in the systemd config. all better ;)
18:07 < kkspy> Hello everyone. I have a question for you, guys. I needed to mount an NFS partition hosted on MacOS to an Ubuntu VM.
18:07 < kkspy> My /etc/exports:      /Users/vasilyzorin/Corona-Host-Shared -alldirs -mapall=82
18:08 < kkspy> My /etc/fstab:   192.168.56.1:/Users/vasilyzorin/Corona-Host-Shared    /shared  nfs auto,noatime,nolock,bg,nfsvers=3,intr,tcp,actimeo=1800 0 0
18:09 < BitShack> Mwaaa
18:09 < kkspy> This is what I get: 8603856288 drwxr-xr-x  5  501 dialout      160 May  7 21:48 .
18:09 < BitShack> Oops wrong chan
18:09 < BitShack> ._.
18:10 < kkspy> I need the ownership to be root:root or www:www rather than 501:dialout.
18:23 < comet23> what kind of linux come with vnc preinstalled?
18:25 < freeone3000> Found the issue! It was docker routing and the response was actually from docker ICMP. Thanks!
18:29 < lukey> kkspy: Your uids need to be the same on both machines
18:30 < lukey> curiousx: Why do you ask?
18:36 < triceratux> http://www.markshuttleworth.com/archives/1521
18:40 < kkspy> lukey: is it possible to change the exported uid/gid?
18:58 < lukey> kkspy: no AFAIK
19:07 < tonyt> Google I/O'18: Google Keynote - YouTube https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogfYd705cRs
19:24 < nnetmauXX> hello
19:35 < Bebef> How do I test if script was invoked interactively by root (or sudo)?
19:35 < Bebef> So, not just the user but also from a commandline
19:36 < Bebef> I tried things like [[ $- == *i* ]] && echo 'Interactive' || echo 'Not interactive' (and all the other google results) but all report "not interactive"
19:43 < mawk> Bebef:
19:43 < mawk> [[ $- == *i* ]] is a good method yes
19:43 < mawk> but a script is never interactive
19:43 < mawk> unless sourced
19:44 < mawk> instead you want to know if the script is run from a terminal Bebef maybe ?
19:44 < mawk> you can do [ -t 0 ] && echo interactive || echo non interactive
19:45 < DevonX|> managed to get plasma desktop to work with the newest ubuntu but the performance is quite bad
19:46 < mawk> Bebef: but if you want 100% correctness you can instead check if you've got a controlling terminal
19:47 < mawk> (exec 9<>/dev/tty)2>/dev/null && echo I have a controlling terminal
19:49 < mawk> I claim copyright on that bash idiom, send me royalties on usage
19:49 < mawk> 1MBvvRBafuKXuLQkWadY618x8CxEjEX3M
19:51 < triceratux> thats what the dedoimedo guy has been saying https://www.dedoimedo.com/computers/kubuntu-beaver.html
19:55 < rockdarko> I have an installation where although everything is detected in the DVDROM (including copy protected DVDs that play without a problem), audio CD's do not work at all. I can't find much online else than being part of the optical group but I assume that's already okay since I can read any other type of content in the same drive.
19:56 < tomty89> rockdarko: define "do not work"
19:56 < tomty89> rockdarko: as in, what exactly were you doing on it
19:58 < tomty89> rockdarko: play it with a player like mpv? or expecting to see "audio files" on it in a file manager?
19:58 < rockdarko> I'm not sure how to explain. Basically, I put a DVD in, it sees everything (data, video, copy protected or not). But if I put an audio CD, although the OS sees it and a quick action dialog pops up with actions such as play with kaffeine, amarok, etc, when I try to play it gives an error that it cannt read it. I tried at least 10 original audio CD's.
19:58 < rockdarko> I even tried with a terminal based audio played.
19:59 < tomty89> like `mpv cdda://`?
19:59 < tomty89> rockdarko: you should get some detailed error messages from such player
20:00 < rockdarko> wow, my parents just pop a dvd in and elft home, so I cant even troubleshoot anymore :( lol
20:00 < rockdarko> the error messages were very generic, but ill try mpv cdda:// later.
20:00 < rockdarko> and come back here if I cant figure it out. thanks.
20:06 < Skunky> rockdarko: sounds like you are missing maybe scsi generic support in your kernel
20:06 < Skunky> rockdarko: dvd's have a filesystem.... data cd's have a filesystem.  audio cd's don't have a filesystem
20:10 < tomty89> Skunky: if he can access dvd then the kernel has driver for the optical drive
20:10 < tomty89> namely sr-mod
20:11 < Skunky> tomty89: yes, but audio cd's don't use the same driver.  sr is for filesystems
20:14 < triceratux> pfft trump starting wwiii
20:15 < triceratux> geez hes terrible. somebody stop him
20:15 < tomty89> Skunky: no, the driver is for the hardware, the drive to be precise; as you mentioned yourself, since audio cd doesn't have filesystem, no driver is need for the data layer
20:15 < tomty89> *needed
20:16 < tomty89> unlike udf / iso9660 or whatsoever
20:17 < tomty89> Skunky: the player (probably in turn one of the libcdio) will take care of the raw stream in red book spec
20:17 < Skunky> tomty89: to read audio cd's digitally, you need the sg driver, not the sr driver.  the end.
20:18 < tomty89> Skunky: sg driver is for a total different purpose
20:18 < tomty89> Skunky: it's not necessary for most users
20:21 < Skunky> tomty89: MOST users aren't trying to listen to audio cd's.
20:24 < tomty89> Skunky: I was. And I never ever accessed an optical drive via /dev/sg* (that is through the sg driver)
20:25 < tomty89> Skunky: maybe in ancient time when libcdio doesn't deal with cdda, it *was* necessary, but at the very least i never experienced that
20:26 < jml2> why do people still use optical drives?
20:26 < jml2> LOL
20:26 < jml2> it's not the 1980's
20:26 < hipp> 90's bud
20:27 < jml2> lol 90's eh?
20:27 < jml2> go back to tape!
20:28 < tomty89> jml2: well people have gone back to vinyl
20:29 < tomty89> jml2: while recording and mixing are probably done digitally
20:29 < jml2> tomty89, what's the issue of the skunky ?
20:29 < triceratux> jml2: because yer usb stops working after a week ? https://techcrunch.com/2018/05/08/ios-will-soon-disable-usb-connection-if-left-locked-for-a-week/
20:30 < jml2> triceratux, I have on my shelf a dead-battery ipod touch,   I rarely ever used it, left it un-used for months, and it's battery became defective on itself.  (true)
20:31 < jml2> triceratux, gave me big insight... Never leave any Apple product unused for months or the battery will kill itself. lol
20:31 < ananke> jml2: that's a bit of an idiotic fault attribution
20:31 < jml2> ananke, I dont use technology, I study and program them
20:31 < jml2> ananke, only idiots like you use Apple products.
20:31 < jml2> LOL
20:31 < jml2> its true... I bought it not so that I can use it ;-)
20:32 < ananke> jml2: your ignorance of said technologies shows. lithium ion batteries are very well known for being damaged if drained completely
20:32 < triceratux> jml2: i had a stored android netbook, pulled it out of the case, the battery had ballooned so severely it had broken the battery compartment cover open. dont store that stuff without keeping it charging all the time
20:32 < jml2> ananke, whoever said the battery was drained?
20:32 < ananke> jml2: I didn't call you an idiot, neither I said anything about using apple products. the fact that you can't distinguish facts from your made up fiction is just pathetic
20:33 < jml2> ananke, keep smirking up words of your wild tech-imagination.
20:33 < ananke> jml2: you really are special. wonder what's the underlying cause
20:34 < jml2> triceratux, there's lots of false advertisizing on anything... did you hear about the problematic news on apple's manipulation of its battery/performance update?
20:34 < jml2> triceratux, a lot of people distrust apple's manipulation of this and think it was done in order to force apple customers to upgrade.
20:34 < jml2> triceratux, made big news some time ago
20:35 < jml2> triceratux, was occuring around the time that apple would be releasing their new product.
20:35 < shan> what is the single-character equivalent of * in bash?
20:35 < ananke> shan: ?
20:35 < triceratux> jml2: apple news is the type im prone to ignore ;)
20:36 < jml2> shan, '?'  :)
20:37 < jml2> shan, ananke likes to leave things out of context :)
20:37 < jml2> shan, the '?' character does a single character
20:37 < shan> jml2: so, quotes are involved?
20:37 < ananke> jml2: don't be an idiot
20:37 < jml2> shan, no.. it is used in terminal
20:37 < jml2> shan, <command> ?abcd
20:37 < jml2> ananke, excuse me?
20:37 < shan> im using the terminal
20:37 < jml2> ananke, you're very rude. don't talk to me.
20:38 < mutante> you ruined the joke ;)
20:38 < ananke> jml2: then perhaps you should keep your comments about others to yourself
20:39 < jml2> and leave out your useless questions as being unhelpful to the question actually being asked.
20:39 < ananke> jml2: I didn't ask any questions. you seem to have a hard time parsing basic english.
20:42 < jml2> mutante, the joke of an "idiotic" fault attribution. I'm not an interested fan of :)
20:43 < jml2> mutante, doesn't take much to try to divert a discussion about a particular problem.
20:43 < toothe> What's the version of Kepass that works on Linux and Windows?
20:43 < jml2> mutante, better I don't feed spit-spat and "ignorance" as way to encourage a discussion.
20:43 < jml2> toothe, keepassx
20:44 < tsaka__> anyone want to code review a bash script (i'm new to bash scripting)
20:44 < jml2> toothe, btw did you fix that popos?
20:44 < jml2> toothe, (themes gtk3)
20:45 < ananke> tsaka__: pastebin the code, people may look at it. also, there's #bash which may be more appropriate
20:45 < toothe> jml2: yes!!
20:45 < toothe> dude, I got it workin on FreeBSD !
20:45 < mutante> jml2: scnr, i didn't mean to upset anyone
20:45 < toothe> so, i fibbed - I wanted to get the  Pop_OS theme on FreeBSD.
20:46 < tsaka__> the script runs a multitude of python simulations which saves some results which are plotted with another python script: https://paste.fedoraproject.org/paste/msFkNJdymWnmkfJnCNlu4w
20:46 < jml2> toothe, you were talking about fixing it on popos some time ago i recall
20:46 < toothe> jml2: Fixing it? I don't follow you?
20:46 < toothe> jml2: I did this: https://www.reddit.com/r/freebsd/comments/8hub8c/installed_pop_oss_theme_on_freebsd_mate/?st=jgy10bcj&sh=76333d31
20:46 < jml2> toothe, dunno about freebsd.. i use lanax on other things
20:46 < jml2> toothe, you the farhan hacker? lol
20:49 < toothe> As I pentest more and more environments and am using 3-4 machines at this point, I need a system to keep my keepass DB up to date.
20:49 < toothe> Not sure what the best solution is.
20:50 < jml2> toothe, the best solution is droidkeep on android which can use the same keepassx database :)
20:51 < jml2> toothe, technically it is "Keepass-Droid" here as I'm looking at it on my phone right now
20:51 < jml2> toothe, (and yes I use it :p)
20:51 < toothe> hm..that might work.
20:51 < toothe> somehow I was thinking a computer though?
20:51 < toothe> That sounds cloudy. Am I mistaken?
20:52 < mutante> if your phone still has USB mass storage, connect it, fire up rsync to sync your keepass file.. if it only speaks MTP .. spend a couple hours getting the file transfer to work :p
20:52 < jml2> toothe, though a little issue of course is you dont get the auto-type from phone to PC XD... that'd be kewl if there was an improved version of this to do this over tls or ssh
20:52 < jml2> toothe, no it uses a local storage db...
20:52 < toothe> I sorta have my own "cloud"
20:52 < jml2> toothe, you can in fact copy your keepassx db to your phone and use keepdroid with it
20:52 < toothe> aka a computer sitting in my basement that's on 24/7
20:52 < toothe> and by computer, I mea na raspberry Pi.
20:52 < toothe> right!
20:52 < toothe> But, what happens if I update it in one place? What about the other 3-4?
20:53 < jml2> toothe, cant
20:53 < prussian> syncthing
20:53 < toothe> well, really its between 2 places.
20:53 < toothe> gosh, I really dislike Windows.
20:53 < prussian> assuming it can get the db from the shared sort of fake sdcard region
20:53 < jml2> toothe, if you place the db file on a shared server you're going to do corruption on it.. it's not a network db.. it's a local-db per app ..
20:53 < toothe> its ZFS.
20:54 < jml2> toothe, so if you have the app opening the db on one machine, you can only have 1 app accessing that flat-file db at a time
20:54 < toothe> maybe a scheduled scp?
20:54 < prussian> uh isn't keepass just some encrypted sqlite3 db?
20:54 < toothe> my phone isn't rooted though, so I don't think I can do scp :(
20:54 < prussian> it's 2018 bro
20:54 < jml2> prussian, probably
20:54 < prussian> syncthing
20:54 < prussian> rsync/scp/rdist is all dinoware
20:54 < jml2> syncthing is good, but it always runs in the background on android
20:55 < toothe> prussian: wait, what's syncthing?
20:55 < jml2> toothe, it's a rsync-like tool for android and pc
20:55 < jml2> toothe, has a dedicated site
20:55 < bls> except it's a gui, so not a rsync/scp replacement
20:55 < jml2> toothe, https://syncthing.net/
20:55 < prussian> the future
20:55 < toothe> i'll check it out whe nI get a moment.
20:55 < toothe> but, why not just rsync? I'm confused.
20:56 < toothe> I understand that we need management. Is it that?
20:56 < prussian> syncthing is multipoint
20:56 < toothe> (sorry, I swear, I'll check it out!!)
20:56 < prussian> i have like 5 machines sharing collections of shared directories
20:57 < jml2> prussian, you use its android app?
20:57 < toothe> seriosuly, once I get MS office working well on Linux.
20:57 < toothe> I'm going to ditch Windows.
20:57 < prussian> I use it to send photos to a syncthing server
20:57 < prussian> i don't really use it, bu ti hate phones anyhow
20:57 < jml2> prussian, lol
20:58 < badsekter> toothe: have you tried libre office?
20:58 < jml2> prussian, I'm for the librem5 phone
20:58 < prussian> same
20:58 < jml2> prussian,  I hate locked-in and hidden daemons on android.
20:58 < toothe> badsekter: yes. Its default settings are not the same as Word.
20:58 < prussian> whenever it's made. I'm already spending time learning gjs just so i can crpa out apps for the phone
20:58 < toothe> badsekter: For example, single spacing between paragraphs.
20:58 < jml2> prussian, its why I hate it.  battery drains 2x faster than i originally got it
20:58 < toothe> badsekter: and things don't render the same.
20:58 < prussian> well
20:58 < badsekter> toothe: hmm ok
20:58 < prussian> ya
20:58 < toothe> badsekter: So, I can't use it :/
20:59 < toothe> Trust me, I'm upset.
20:59 < prussian> but i guess I can't say how well syncthing works for db's. if you got one person opening and making a change and closing. it will kind of work
20:59 < jml2> toothe, be sure to check out the "ribbon" toolbar with the latest libreoffice (it needs to be enabled from an advanced setting)
20:59 < toothe> I would really prefer it, honestly.
20:59 < jml2> toothe, makes it much more intuitive to utilize
20:59 < toothe> jml2: ahh...so, I actually don't even mind that.
21:00 < toothe> It isn't the layout. Its the default settings.
21:00 < toothe> For example, you know how a new paragraph might have a gap? I don't know the terminology.
21:00 < jml2> toothe, the default settings still dont allow to toggle the ribbon toolbar :) (it's in a setting somewhere you need to enable experimental -- but it is quite stable)
21:01 < toothe> jml2: right, but that isn't the problem for me.
21:01 < jml2> toothe, the big projects like libreoffice, vbox --- I dont even rely on my distro's repository, rather just get it from upstream .deb sources... you get the latest and greatest..
21:01 < toothe> its that the defaults are not the same as word.
21:01 < toothe> ahh...
21:01 < toothe> wow, you compile LibreOffice??
21:01 < jml2> toothe, lol no!
21:01 < toothe> the guy who makes HardenedBSD said it took him like 2 days to do.
21:02 < toothe> oh, i misread you. Their deb packages. Misread you lol.
21:02 < jml2> toothe, these large projects devote to releasing .deb and .rpm things...
21:02 < jml2> toothe, they're more updated than distro repos..
21:02 < jml2> toothe, you'll like the new ribbon toolbar with LO..
21:02 < jml2> toothe, its what MSoffice is well known for..
21:02 < toothe> righ right, but I keep saying
21:02 < toothe> that isn't an issue.
21:03 < toothe> I don't care about the ribbon either way.
21:03 < jml2> lol
21:03 < jml2> then why work to get MSOffice working perfectly on Linux then?
21:03 < bls> for one default setting
21:04 < toothe> no, its several things. I can't quite narrow them all down, but several things just act differently.
21:04 < toothe> I tried to insert an image into a document. I never figured out hwo to do it.
21:04 < toothe> It would appear as a floating image.
21:04 < toothe> Rather than an inline inage.
21:04 < jml2> you can just drag and drop a picture
21:04 < toothe> yes - and its floating.
21:04 < wadadli> why does virsh console set the term to vt220>
21:04 < jml2> oh that's called "anchoring"
21:04 < bls> so it's preference which is a fair enough reason to not switch
21:04 < toothe> I wanted an innline image.
21:04 < toothe> jml2: and that's awesome, I will definitely try that.
21:04 < wadadli> causes me this weird issue seen here https://streamable.com/otor0
21:05 < toothe> but,you see my point, no?
21:05 < jml2> toothe, by default new images are anchored to either a page, a frame, or as a text character..
21:05 < toothe> jml2: hm...wasn't my experience on Mint.
21:05 < hexnewbie> wadadli: Are you sure it's virsh, and not the getty in the guest? See the systemd service for the getty
21:05 < toothe> I hope Libre kills MS
21:05 < jml2> toothe, if using it on a "document", you'll want it anchored as a text character
21:05 < jml2> toothe, (look up online on LO's anchoring)
21:05 < toothe> jml2: That should be the default behavior.
21:06 < toothe> I was writing a 40 page report. I didn' thave time to learn that.
21:06 < toothe> and with respect, I don't want to.
21:06 < jml2> toothe, if say you are using lo-draw (for making an ads-like/brochure project), you'll want to anchor it to the page.. so any new elements dont push the image around
21:06 < Dagmar> So don't complain when things don't work like you expected them to if you never read any instructions
21:07 < toothe> that sounds very logical Dagmar, I'm sure it does.
21:07 < wadadli> hexnewbie ▸ hm.
21:07 < toothe> but if its a direct competitor to MS Word, and perhaps really the only competitor, then I hope they target the market.
21:07 < hexnewbie> Image anchoring in LO should work the same way as in Word. I mean, I've learned how to do this on Word, and then Writer seemed to work the same way
21:07 < toothe> but then again, thsi is Free software, so I can't complain.
21:07 < Dagmar> Well, you can always just carry on behaving like an entitled prat and see how far that gets you
21:08 < Mysterytrain> I have two esata enclosures connected to a PCIE esata card, which is in a ubuntu server 18.04 machine. the problem is that only one box at a time appears to be seen by the machine. any ideas what can be causing this?
21:08 < Dagmar> The last time I checked tho, computers don't care how you feel about things.
21:08 < toothe> Dagmar: I'm not. I just buy WOrd.
21:08 < toothe> bought*
21:08 < toothe> actually, we got Office 365.
21:08 < Dagmar> ...and you will enjoy making terrible documents with it, I'm sure.  Remember, this is not the channel to ask for help with Microsoft products when they export cooked files nothing else wants to read properly.
21:09 < toothe> Dagmar: I never said it was.
21:09 < toothe> calm down.
21:09 < toothe> I love Linux, have run it for years - since kernel 2.0. I'm just expressing my experiences having tried to use it purely in the business world. Its a little different.
21:10 < snugger> THIS IS A TEST 1
21:10 < jml2> toothe, https://imgur.com/a/SyNmOYU
21:10 < toothe> jml2: I will def try that next time :)
21:10 < toothe> which'll be soon.
21:10 < jml2> toothe, you just have to look at the top-left corner of one of the standard toolbars and check to paragraph or 'as character'..
21:11 < bls> you weren't very judicuious, you're not happy LO doesn't work exactly the same as MS Word and weren't willing to figure out why due to time constraints. if you'd just said that from the beginning, none of this discussion would be going on
21:11 < toothe> bls: Fair.
21:11 < Dagmar> If they ever make it work like word I'll be pissed
21:12 < toothe> Confession: I actually wrote the entire report in LibreOffice, EXCEPT for the images :)
21:12 < toothe> and a fwe other things ,but I forgot what they were.
21:12 < zeldafan78> Nice to see that the FOSS community is strong and healthy... https://news.slashdot.org/story/18/05/08/1712221/ubuntu-considering-an-html5-based-os-installer
21:12 < Dagmar> The number of edge case bugs that "professional" package has is shameful
21:13 < zeldafan78> I swear... This is some sort of test or joke or something. "Just How long will it take before zeldafan78 goes insane from all this madness?"
21:13 < Dagmar> zeldafan78: Apparently people are complaining the OS installs too quickly or something somewhere
21:13 < toothe> heh, I used Linux back when everyone told me it was a stupid system and Windows NT was the future.
21:13 < toothe> When MS wrote an article about how Windows NT was superior to Linux.
21:13 < toothe> and I was like 15
21:13 < zeldafan78> Both Linux and Windows and all the other OSes that I know of are absolute garbage, and it's just getting worse by the year or even day these days.
21:14 < Dagmar> So stop using Ubuntu
21:14 < zeldafan78> I don't.
21:14 < wadadli> hexnewbie ▸ great call.
21:14 < toothe> really? You have had bad experiences with Linux?
21:14 < toothe> I've only had positive experiences post-Ubuntu.
21:14 < zeldafan78> toothe: Very much so.
21:14 < bls> they should just ditch the whole installer, write a new one in JS, run it in node. so your installer is a browser app
21:14 < sbef> ehy guys. i love gnome. i love my personification. But suddenly i found something wrong when i unlocked my session today. WHAT IS THAT DAMN BAR AT THE BOTTOM?! https://ibb.co/cec4Yn
21:14 < toothe> Dagmar: Something tells me you and I are on the opposite ends of the spectrum on computers :)
21:15 < toothe> Dagmar: but its cool!
21:15 < Dagmar> sbef: Describe it
21:15 < jml2> zeldafan78, some distros are a one-man show and lack vigour updates
21:15 < Dagmar> sbef: Theres at least three things at the bottom of the screen
21:15 < sbef> it is the one with all the opened programs, in windows stylw
21:15 < sbef> style
21:16 < sbef> toothe: what's your spectrum
21:16 < jml2> there's one thing I like with oss things, and that is "good fonts" --- there's a lot of "bad fonts" that come with distros, and I think this is something distros suffer...
21:16 < Dagmar> sbef: It's a task manager, exactly like you described.  It's been there in Gnome for ages
21:16 < sbef> jml2: right, they're missing comics sans ms
21:17 < Dagmar> abef: Normally you can turn it off, but maybe after the last set of patches the Gnome team decided your workflow would be better enhanced if you no longer had the ability to do without one
21:17  * jml2 uses google.com/fonts and likes fonts not readily avail on any distro
21:17 < jml2> it also makes my lo-documents fantastic
21:17 < jml2> lo-draw especially when I need to make signs for someone
21:17 < sbef> Dagmar: ok... do you know how i supposed to disable it? i do not really like it (i've been ussing gnome only in the last year... before i used a xp like gui... tde so i didn't know!)
21:17 < jml2> (adverts)
21:18 < sbef> Dagmar: sorry i saw nnow the second message
21:18 < Dagmar> sbef: It's part of the panels so wherever you usually go to confugure/add/remove those
21:18 < sbef> Dagmar: ugh i do not like when people decide what's better for me ahahah
21:18 < Dagmar> sbef: You might want to switch over to Mate then, because that's the primary reason they forked GNOME around the 2.x/3.x changeover
21:19 < Dagmar> Too many abominative changes to GNOME 3.0 that all came down to "We know how you should be using your computer" when the devs were asked about it
21:19 < sbef> Dagmar: i love gnome this far ugh :'( anyway, thank you a lot
21:20 < sbef> then gnome developers have a new "hater" ahahah
21:20 < sbef> this taskbar is so ugly
21:20 < jml2> sbef, that is possibly started (plank-docker whatever it is called) -- from /etc/xdg/autostart --- you should be able to disable it with your Autostart settings for your desktop..., otherwise you'll need to remove it from /etc/xdg/autostart
21:20 < Dagmar> _Eventually_ they're going to get tired of sniffing their own farts and/or listening to the people who do enjoy sniffing their own farts
21:20 < toothe> oh damn, I think I could get used to Gnome.
21:20 < jml2> sbef, are you talking about that?
21:20 < jml2> lol
21:20 < jml2> Dagmar, yuck!
21:20 < sbef> jml2: no i like the docker... it's the taskbar
21:21 < sbef> thank you still!
21:21 < toothe> Is there a way to adjust the applets on the Gnome bar? I ask because I would like to get a gamma brightness changer.
21:21 < Dagmar> jml2: I really can't think of any handier metaphor for the kind of devs who make radical changes to UI/workflow and then tell literally everyone else that they're wrong to think the changes were bad
21:21 < sbef> toothe: i have gamma brightness changer and does not work :)
21:21 < toothe> sbef: Do you have a desktop or laptop?
21:22 < sbef> laptop
21:22 < toothe> sbef: I run Cinammon at home and there is one that does work.
21:22 < sbef> cinammon if i'm not wrong it's a fork of gnome... maybe they have some bugs shared
21:22 < jml2> Dagmar, some changes are good and some changes are bad.. I remember I actually had a happy time with a "well established" desktop I call KDE... before it became "Plasma"... that 3.x look was sharp, "STABLE" and simply just all around awesome.
21:22 < toothe> very likely, but this one works foor me. I had problems earlier with the same thing.
21:23 < sbef> i3-wm is the way
21:23 < Dagmar> jml2: This wasn't a matter of looks.  This was literally functionality
21:23 < jml2> Dagmar, so I still tend to go along with distros/projects that support trinity..
21:23 < jml2> Dagmar, (trinity -- the kde3x fork for kde)
21:23 < kremator> sbef, yeah cinnamon it's a fork from gnome 2, but they have developed it a fuckton since then, nowadays it's a very big project on it's own
21:23 < sbef> jml2: i love trinity
21:23 < Dagmar> jml2: For longer than it took me to completely lose interest, if you had say, six xterms open, the task manager would only list _one_ item
21:24 < sbef> kremator: ok never mind about what i said then!
21:24 < jml2> Dagmar, I tihnk a lot of people can agree with me... from 3.x to 4.x was too much of a dramatic change.. they should of continued with support for 3.x frameworks.. they went all completely for the "tablet" and that left a lot of unhappy customers
21:24 < Dagmar> jml2: They were foolishly trying to unify touchscreen, small screen, and desktop user interfaces, and this is pretty much a "known" that is something that isn't possible without crippling everything
21:25 < jml2> Dagmar, definitely and so much breakage that even on "stable releases" of say debian was suffering a lot of complaints
21:25 < sbef> Dagmar: windows 8 teaches
21:25 < jml2> Dagmar, kde became a bad name for much brokerage after that...
21:25 < Dagmar> jml2: But the not listening to a damn thing anyone was saying after and not heeding any of the actual abstract research that had been done prior made walking away from that mess something I had to do
21:25 < Psi-Jack> sbef: To hate Windows?
21:26 < sbef> Psi-Jack: ahahah
21:26 < sbef> nah
21:26 < kremator> Best DE = xfce, prove me wrong you KDEtards
21:26 < Psi-Jack> Then you're wrong.
21:26 < sbef> for that there's windows irc channek
21:26 < sbef> channel*
21:26 < Dagmar> sbef: Dude, honestly, I've been using computers since the 80's.  Most of these lessons were learned before some of the GNOME devs were even born
21:26 < Psi-Jack> kremator: Easy. Bias.
21:26 < Psi-Jack> Pwned. :)
21:27 < jml2> sbef, trinity was difficult to become stable here on debian, eventually it worked here with the latest debian/testing --- which i installed 2 weeks ago(trinity finally works here)
21:27 < sbef> Dagmar: i wasn't alive in the 80's so i'm sorry i just look at the big failures i saw ahahahah
21:27 < kremator> Psi-Jack, but if im biased is because i do really discovered the true best de once i found xfce
21:27 < tpe> TIL I'm a KDE "tard".
21:27 < sbef> jml2: i use q4os, and it works greatly with kde... it is debian based!
21:27 < jml2> sbef, but it still lacks a few elements I like which is why I cannot move to it (it still has a couple problems that get in the way)
21:27 < Dagmar> Trying to get multitouch and point&grunt interfaces to work the same way is a bit like trying to get paintings and music to work the same way
21:27 < jml2> sbef, q4os is good ..
21:27 < jml2> sbef, however i hate its developer who keeps its source closed...
21:27 < Psi-Jack> kremator: That, and, name-calling others based on their DE, that's elitism, also makes you look bad. :)
21:27 < snugger> Q4OS is pretty bad last I tried it
21:28 < jml2> sbef, (their package management things)
21:28 < jml2> sbef, if only they opened that..
21:28 < snugger> It was just...weird
21:28 < kremator> Psi-Jack, when you use the best of the best, you have to be elitist
21:28 < sbef> jml2: i like q4os because in the end i have a stable debian based distro with a really awesome hardware support
21:28 < jml2> sbef, but still good overall... a great choice for trinity things.. q4os i like as well..
21:28 < jml2> sbef, very stable, fast and functional.. like a desktop is supposed to be
21:28 < sbef> jml2: right
21:29 < sbef> snugger: it's weird as f you're right ahahahah
21:29 < jml2> sbef, you dont need much hardware support to get q4os running.. it's meant to also run on legacy hardware.. but its also targetted for new machines as well
21:29 < Techknight_> Hi guys. does any of you use pastebinit? and have a working config with pastebin pro?
21:29 < Psi-Jack> kremator: Oh? How about this then? XFCE + i3wm instead of xfwm. Nautilus instead of Thunar. Gnome-Terminal instead of xfce4-terminal. Gedit instead of mousepad/leafpad.
21:29 < jml2> sbef, lots of packages from the debian repository .. otherwise I wouldn't suggest q4os..
21:29 < Psi-Jack> Techknight_: Never use pastebin.com
21:29 < Psi-Jack> Never pay pastebin.com for "Pro" status.
21:30 < sbef> jml2: i love the fact that i do not need to look for al property drivers by my self since they're pre-installed! it even works with some wifi usb adapters who's installation disks do no work on linux!
21:30 < sbef> Psi-Jack: gedit D:
21:30 < Techknight_> Psi-Jack:  I really like pastebin and I need some of the pro features it provides.
21:30 < dgurney> I actually like gedit for being very simple
21:30 < jml2> pcmanfm for the win... I use it on any desktop...
21:30 < triceratux> jml2: i think you should try the sweedish deepin. maybe arne has mitigated the cnzz stuff entirely http://www.extix.se/?p=407
21:30 < dgurney> kate is also pretty cool
21:31 < sbef> dgurney: i rather prefer geany
21:31 < jml2> pcmanfm >> caja >> nautilus >> thunar  :p
21:31 < jml2> triceratux, interesting...
21:31 < sbef> isn't deepin the super chinese distro?
21:31 < dgurney> yes
21:31 < Techknight_> sbef yuo
21:31 < jml2> sbef, yeah they added a controversial tracker which led people to be upset on it.
21:31 < sbef> https://www.deepin.org/ ahahah definitely
21:32 < sbef> jml2: what tracker?
21:32 < dgurney> deepin desktop is rather nice IMO
21:32 < jml2> sbef, in the deepin store app
21:32 < sbef> ooh ok
21:32 < dgurney> you can even install it on other distros, but it may have some strange issues
21:32 < jml2> sbef, they got a lot of flak for that and had to make a message to their forum users what it is.. and what exactly is being tracked...
21:32 < dgurney> when I last tried it on arch, it sometimes took seconds for the dock/taskbar thingy to show up
21:32 < jml2> sbef, but still people are left with question
21:32 < dgurney> when at other times it was basically instant
21:33 < sbef> jml2: i see
21:33 < Dagmar> dgurney: Sounds like it was waiting on dbus stuff
21:34 < dgurney> dunno, either way it's been a while so my experience isn't completely up-to-date
21:35 < sbef> soooo
21:35 < za1b1tsu> regarding terminals and bit colors. Is 24 bit color the highest?
21:36 < Psi-Jack> Techknight_: pastebin.com is frowned upon due to many issues they themselves have caused. Pastes being reformatted, malvertising, adblock blocking, being blocked due to many reasons. See /topic for the channel's official pastebin.
21:36 < sbef> not finding a way to switch this thing off..... suggestion to what gui switch to? i love eye candy things :) or i3. i3 is the coolest.
21:36 < Psi-Jack> Techknight_: If you want to support a company that does all that.... Good luck.
21:36 < pankaj> What is the standard tool for benchmarking in linux community?
21:36 < Psi-Jack> pankaj: Benchmarking what?
21:37 < dgurney> pankaj, benchmarking what?`there are multiple benchmarking utilities
21:37 < ayecee> linux :D
21:37 < pankaj> dgurney: What is the most used or commonly used and still in wide use?
21:38 < Techknight_> Psi-Jack:  I guess I will try to see if there is any other good options for creating pastes (and private) any good alternatives you know of?
21:38 < meyou> pankaj, there are many different aspects of performance one might want to benchmark, the answer depends on which aspect you're looking for
21:39 < dgurney> I think the closest you can get to an "unified" benchmarking tool is phoronix test suite, but even that depends on external utilities (which also depends on what benchmark you want to run)
21:39 < Namll> say there was a malicious process running on your machine, would you be able to detect if with something like top or ps?
21:39 < jml2> za1b1tsu, 24-bit for terminal sounds like a dream
21:39 < jml2> za1b1tsu, lol
21:39 < Psi-Jack> Techknight_: Run your own Stikked server.
21:39 < jml2> za1b1tsu, no way hozay!
21:40 < jml2> pankaj, the standard benchmarking tool in linux, you mean for "hard disks" ?
21:40 < jml2> pankaj, the defacto for system things in general is "sar"
21:41 < pankaj> meyou: I saw a website Userbenchmark.com but it is mainly for windows user. So, I thought their might be one for linux also.
21:41 < Psi-Jack> pankaj: Benchmarking what?
21:41 < jml2> pankaj, phoronix.org
21:41 < pankaj> jml2: To check the performance of my system as per the standard one.
21:41 < jml2> pankaj, .com rather
21:41 < Psi-Jack> pankaj: Disk? Network? Graphics? CPU? etc.
21:42 < pankaj> Psi-Jack: OK.
21:42 < Psi-Jack> Benchmarking isn't /one/ thing.
21:42 < pankaj> Psi-Jack: CPU and  Disk
21:43 < Psi-Jack> But, in Linux, there are different tools to benchmark different things.
21:43 < Psi-Jack> For disk, there's fio and bonnie++
21:44 < Psi-Jack> sysbench and phoronix-test-suite for CPU are viable, and test different aspects.
21:44 < pankaj> Psi-Jack: Is their any resource like any article best explaining that and about the tools to be used specifically.
21:44 < Psi-Jack> Google.com
21:45 < Psi-Jack> Search  terms: linux benchmark <what>
21:45 < pankaj> Psi-Jack: Thanks
21:45 < Dagmar> But... but... all teh websites show benchmarks are just one numbar!
21:45 < za1b1tsu> jml2: termite, st have 24-bit support
21:46 < Dagmar> How can they make simple lists declaring a specific pecking order for hardware like that?
21:46 < Dagmar> It's almost like they don't really care about being accurate, as long as it looks like they were reporting useful information
21:47 < meyou> a proper benchmark should just give you a happy face or a sad face as the result
21:47 < Dagmar> Does ConstraintLayout require id on all of it's children or something?
21:47 < Dagmar> !@#$@!
21:54 < texla> Install Mageia 6 from install dvd to 32 gb usb drive..can boot to login but will not accept my password ..can this be corrected
21:55 < revel> texla: Yes. Change the password and make sure you remember/write it correctly this time.
21:56 < revel> Maybe avoid using characters that may be different on different keyboard layouts?
21:57 < Techknight_> Psi-Jack: I guess I will give it a try.
21:58 < texla> revel, Not sure how to change the password..the one I use is letters and 2 number
21:59 < Sleepingshell> I am planning on migrating my current linux install to a new one, on a new SSD. Do I need to parition the new drive with the same sizes as my current one? Additionally I have an encrypted partition that holds me /home,/var and swap. Wondering the best way to do this. Should I just install the new install (Arch) normally and then migrate the data and change the fstab? Ideally I would like to keep the same
21:59 < Sleepingshell> encrypted data (same key, etc)
22:00 < bls> Sleepingshell: you'd server yourself much better with a fresh install tailored to the new disk and just migrating your data over
22:00 < revel> texla: Just to check, you didn't use any characters not present on a en-US keyboard layout, did you? Since that might have caused this. Anyways, well, uhh, there's probably instructions on how to do it online, probably by either chroot-ing in from the liveCD or booting with init=/bin/sh or something.
22:00 < Sleepingshell> bls: alright I'll do that then. Really I only need to migrate the /home data I think
22:01 < Sleepingshell> Hope Arch isn't too bad for me lol
22:02 < bls> Sleepingshell: /home for sure. might want to at least back up /etc (and maybe /var, /srv, /opt, /usr/local) in the event you've customized anything in those places
22:03 < texla> revel, The keys I use on a stand keyboard the numbers need the numlock activated..Maybe reinstall easieast and fastest way ??
22:04 < revel> texla: Well, if you haven't done anything but run the install CD yet, then it's probably the easiest thing to do.
22:05 < texla> revel, thanks for the info I will format the usb and reinstall
22:05 < revel> Format the USB? You were installing to an USB then?
22:06 < revel> I think that could have its own problems associated with it at times. Not sure though.
22:06 < texla> revel, yes to a 32gb sandisk cruiser glide
22:07 < revel> triceratux: You'd know about this, right? Common pitfalls relating to installing to an USB drive?
22:07 < Sleepingshell> bls: Thanks for the tip. Since I'm moving to a new SSD I think I will try only migrating /home and see how stuff works out
22:09 < TBotNik> All; Having issues with MySQL! Will not start!  When I run "service mysql start" I get the error "start: Job failed to start"! I ran some recovery BASH scripts I had from before and was, when running the cmd "mysqld -u root -p --skip-grant-options" getting the error: "mysql error: 'Can't connect to local MySQL server through socket '/var/run/mysqld/mysqld.sock' (2)'" but after running the scripts now getting the error: "180508 13:
22:09 < TBotNik> 51:37 [Warning] Ignoring user change to 'root' because the user was set to 'mysql' earlier on the command line"!
22:09 < snugger> In case you have never heard of it, you all should try the joe text editor. It's like nano but with more space for typing, less dependencies/bloat and support for global color formatting
22:10 < TBotNik> All: So then ran the cmd: "mysqld -u mysql -p --skip-grant-options" it says it started and gives a process number, but running "ps -A | grep mysql" or "ps -A | grep mysqld" nothing shows. and even running "ps -A | grep procnumber" shows no process.  What do I need to fix this?
22:12 < zave> hello, if my kernel list is https://pastebin.com/DTXb5yDE, and my /etc/default/grub says "DEFAULT_GRUB=0", then do i only need to change that line to "DEFAULT_GRUB=1" to make this Ubuntu 1604 server boot to 4.4.0-122?
22:12 < triceratux> revel: nope. thats why i dont run installers in fact. distros are variegated enough without having to wander into that stuff
22:23 < Psi-Jack> Techknight_: Yeah. Running your own if you need it, is always going to be better than paying pastebin.com for anything. They've burned a LOT of bridges.
22:24 < Psi-Jack> And there's many opensource alternatives to choose from. Stikked, GhostScript, Sticky Notes, termbin, etc.
22:24 < rascul> there are about 15 million pastebins you can run, 20 million free pastebin sites, and it takes about 10 minutes to make your own from scratch
22:24 < Psi-Jack> Hastebin, too, IIRC
22:25 < Psi-Jack> heh
22:25 < Psi-Jack> Also true. :)
22:25 < Psi-Jack> Course the 10 minutes part is variable depending on skill of programming.
22:25 < Techknight_> Psi-Jack: well I definitely need it! but unfortunately it is 1 day and 19.99 $ too late to not pay pastebin...... but hastebin doesn't seem to support the need of having private snippets
22:25 < Techknight_> I know :D
22:26 < Psi-Jack> The only way to have truly private pastes, is run your own.
22:28 < toothe> odd - Gnome doesn't have a way to minimize a WIndow?
22:28 < rascul> it does, but gnome loves to remove and hide features that everybody uses, so maybe not
22:28 < Psi-Jack> The minimize I believe id disabled? By default?
22:28 < toothe> oh wait, silly question.
22:28 < Psi-Jack> The idea with gnome is to not minimize, but utilize spaces.
22:28 < hipp> toothe> yes it does ...  may need to change your theme
22:28 < snugger> rascul: I don't see how anybody could stand using GNOME
22:29 < toothe> I'm on day 2 of Pop!_OS
22:29 < rascul> snugger i couldn't use it standing or sitting
22:29 < Techknight_> Psi-Jack:  and again, to make sure it is 100% private you have to read the source code :S
22:29 < snugger> rascul: I couldn't use it dead
22:29 < rascul> me neither
22:29 < snugger> That sounded stupid
22:29 < snugger> lmao
22:29 < Psi-Jack> Techknight_: Did you already pay for pastebin pro? If so, get a refund.
22:29 < Psi-Jack> heh
22:29 < Techknight_> oooh, I will see if that is possibl
22:29 < bls> the common line from the gnome team is that they put out a very restrictive, opinionated DE and you're expected to add plugins to make it behave the way you want
22:30 < Techknight_> possible
22:30 < Psi-Jack> It is.
22:30 < popnfloss> bls: thats not the real problem with gnome
22:30 < popnfloss> the problem with gnome is the fact that its had the same memory leak bug for like the past 5 years and they still havent figured out how to fix it
22:30 < popnfloss> so to use gnome you have to hit alt f2 and restart it every hour or so
22:31 < popnfloss> thats gnomes best feature
22:31 < popnfloss> being able to restart it when it eats up all your computers ram
22:31 < snugger> GNOME is so restrictive it doesn't allow you to change the default terminal
22:31 < popnfloss> i dont mind that
22:31 < snugger> Without a huge hassle at least
22:31 < snugger> Or file manager
22:31 < Psi-Jack> gnome-terminal is actually really good.
22:32 < popnfloss> if i want to spend hours tinkering with stuff and customizing my DE to my exact specifications then i would use KDE
22:32 < Psi-Jack> nautilus also is pretty good, and well supported by 3rd parties, like dropbox, nextcloud, etc.
22:32 < popnfloss> and i used to do that but these days i just want to keep it simple
22:32 < bls> "the defaults aren't exactly what I want, so it sucks!"
22:32 < snugger> I do like Terminator, which is based on gnome-terminal
22:32 < Psi-Jack> snugger: No it's not.
22:32 < Psi-Jack> Not even close.
22:32 < popnfloss> and i like that gnome has done away with desktop icons and the system tray, which a lot of people are mad about
22:33 < ||JD||> toothe: I think you can add the minimize button with gnome-tweaks package, gnome developers love to do that kind of things that nobody with a brain can understand
22:33 < snugger> "Terminator: multiple gnome-terminals in one window"
22:33 < Psi-Jack> Desktop icons? but.. why?
22:33 < snugger> Yes it is
22:33 < Psi-Jack> snugger: It is not.
22:33 < popnfloss> because its just unnecessary
22:33 < snugger> Yes it is
22:33 < Psi-Jack> snugger: Terminator is not in any way based on anything. It is in fact, completely unique code. In fact, it's written in python. Gnome-Terminal is written in C.
22:33 < triceratux> why doesnt someone come up with urxvt-improved that stops using .Xresources & has a gui for all its settings that stores them in an ordinary rc file like lxterminal & xfce4-terminal ?
22:33 < snugger> The website says
22:34 < snugger> "Much of the behaviour of Terminator is based on GNOME Terminal, and we are adding more features from that as time goes by, but we also want to extend out in different directions with useful features for sysadmins and other users"
22:34 < popnfloss> i have dash to panel, so i have a windows 7 like panel with the superbar and all the pinned applications i use
22:34 < popnfloss> so theres no need to have extra copies of all those icons on the desktop
22:34 < Psi-Jack> Behavior...
22:34 < popnfloss> and have more of the same icons in the notification area
22:34 < snugger> Yeah
22:34 < snugger> It's based on its behavior
22:34 < Psi-Jack> That's it... One thing, and not even a tangible thing.
22:35 < popnfloss> windows should have done the same thing
22:35 < snugger> It's still heavily inspired for their website to be called "gnometerminator"
22:35 < Psi-Jack> LOL
22:35 < popnfloss> the only thing i dislike about gnome, besides the memory leak, is the inability to change the size of the icon grid in the application overview
22:35 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: Or the titlebar size? ;)
22:36 < Psi-Jack> Without using CSS of course.
22:36 < popnfloss> there arent any DEs that let you change the titlebar size
22:36 < Psi-Jack> Sure tehre are.
22:36 < popnfloss> thats determined by theme
22:36 < Psi-Jack> You can change the titlebar size in fvwm2 rather quite easilly.
22:36 < snugger> fvwm is a great window manager
22:36 < popnfloss> thats not a de, thats a window manager
22:37 < Psi-Jack> Every DE has a window-manager.
22:37 < popnfloss> which uses its own titlebars and not themed gtk ones
22:37 < Psi-Jack> Gnome's just happends to be... What. gnome-shell itself?
22:37 < triceratux> the xfce4 titlebar size is determined by the xfwm4 theme. theres quite a bit of variation
22:37 < ||JD||> among other stupid thing gnome does, due that wall wasn't broadcasting to gnome-terminal I discovered they deceided to skip the POSIX way to notify the system about logged in users in favor of their own implementation
22:37 < popnfloss> xfce and mate both have their own problems
22:38 < Psi-Jack> I don't even really know what a titlebar is anymore these days anyway. heh
22:38 < popnfloss> for example in xfce, pretty much every theme you use leave you with a 1 pixel handle to resize windows
22:38 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: No, that's simply not true.
22:38 < popnfloss> and every time anyone reports it to the xfce team, they close it and say its not their problem, its the themes problem
22:39 < popnfloss> even though you can use the same theme in gnome and be able to resize it easily
22:39 < Psi-Jack> That, and.. Alt Right-click. Learn it, use it, love it.
22:39 < popnfloss> also xfce still doesnt have a superbar or a native menu editor
22:39 < Psi-Jack> If you even need it. LOL
22:39 < triceratux> popnfloss: theres a keyboard command in xfce4 to fire up the window resize dialogue
22:39 < popnfloss> thats retarded
22:39 < popnfloss> thats not an excuse for not knowing how to handle windows
22:40 < popnfloss> also thunar has had the same bug in it for years where the column widths arent saved
22:40 < Psi-Jack> Alt+Right-Click is pretty standard across most window-managers.
22:41 < popnfloss> not a solution
22:41 < Psi-Jack> That's not a bug.
22:41 < toothe> I am seriously in love with this theme.
22:41 < jim> I'm not sure my xfce is set up right on my laptop... I changed the wm to i3, and then, when the laptop blanks for inactivity, it doesn't come back when I hit a key
22:41 < ayecee> get a room!
22:41 < toothe> I grew up using Blackbox on Linux 2.0. And I'm in love with it!
22:41 < toothe> with Pop_OS
22:41 < jim> I'm in a room
22:41 < Psi-Jack> jim: Hmmmm
22:41 < toothe> No, you're in a channel you jerk.
22:41 < snugger> Fluxbox is my favorite window manager
22:41 < toothe> Go back to AIM!
22:41 < triceratux> popnfloss: menus are an xdg thing these days anyway. code your own /usr/share/desktop-directories & /usr/share/applications. no need for a specific editor
22:41 < ayecee> i'm on a boat
22:42 < toothe> snugger: I think Fluxbox and balckbox are related.
22:42 < popnfloss> Psi-Jack: thats like saying the start menu button not working isnt a bug because you can just press the super key to open it
22:42 < snugger> Yes they are
22:42 < Psi-Jack> Someone, jump on ayecee and start singing "I'm on a boat!"
22:42 < snugger> The thing I love about Fluxbox is that it comes with its own panel
22:42 < jim> no, really, I'm in a room! there are even a couple doors and winders!
22:42 < snugger> I couldn't imagine not having a panel to manage my tabs
22:42 < popnfloss> "don't do it that way, then" is not a solution to a bug
22:42 < ayecee> but it can be a resolution to the problem that the bug causes
22:43 < Psi-Jack> snugger: What's a panel?
22:43 < snugger> Psi-Jack: ...
22:43 < popnfloss> what if im disabled and its difficult for me to hold alt and right click every time i want to resize a window
22:43 < Psi-Jack> snugger: Oh, you mean the fluxbox toolbar?
22:43 < ayecee> you could have your seeing eye dog do it
22:44 < snugger> I've always called them a panel
22:44 < ayecee> or you could use sticky keys for that
22:44 < Psi-Jack> snugger: No, it's called a toolbar.
22:44 < Psi-Jack> Matches up with the *.toolbar.* options in the config.
22:44 < jim> Psi-Jack, yeah, so I haven't fired the xfce lately on the laptop
22:45 < wonderer> hi all
22:45 < jim> hi
22:45 < popnfloss> i looked at the latest version of xfce and its going to be shittier whenever its released
22:45 < triceratux> im on lxqt with the pcmanfm-qt desktop turned off cause who needs those icons anyway ? i use qiv to set the wallpaper, have a conventional style panel with a menu & a system tray, & theres one openbox theme thats at least tolerable
22:45 < popnfloss> all the text is bold and you cant change it
22:45 < popnfloss> desktop icon labels dont work with themes, theyre just solid white
22:45 < wonderer> ive setup a mount point manually on my raspberrypi and works fine usinf >> mount -t nfs 192.168.4.10:/volume1/raspberry-pi /mnt/raspberry
22:45 < popnfloss> so if you do like desktop icons, then be prepared for that
22:45 < wonderer> but when i add it to /etc/fstab as >> 192.168.4.10:/volume1/raspberry-pi /mnt/raspberry  nfs   options,here 0 0
22:46 < wonderer> it does not work after reboot
22:46 < wonderer> any ideas
22:46 < wonderer> ?
22:46 < jim> what does it do instead??
22:46 < popnfloss> i would probably use mate if they had a superbar applet
22:47 < wonderer> i get this
22:47 < wonderer> pi@rasp: sudo mount -a
22:47 < wonderer> mount.nfs: an incorrect mount option was specified
22:47 < popnfloss> i might try cinnamon again sometime, but idk
22:47 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: Heh. So I use a very hybrid DE, myself. XFCE4 session with xfce4-panel, i3 window-manager, i3-workspaces-plugin for xfce panel, gnome-terminal, nautilus, gedit (mostly for jotting streams of conciousness and possibly saving them later.).
22:47 < popnfloss> its like gnome in that you need extensions to make it good, but the problem is almost all the extensions are not actively maintained and arent compatible with any existing versions of cinnamon
22:48 < jim> wonderer, ok, what options did you set for that mount in fstab?
22:48 < popnfloss> they change it too much and break the extensions even worse than the gnome team does
22:48 < triceratux> anything substandard in lxqt i just fix with the best parts of xfce4: xfce4-terminal, mousepad, ristretto 0.8.0. hybrid DE setups ftw
22:49 < popnfloss> i dont like to spend time doing all that these days, i just want one cohesive DE that is mostly useable out of the box
22:49 < Psi-Jack> For a while I did try the Cinnamon alternatives, nemo and such. But, then I realized how much they sucked. heh
22:49 < bls> Psi-Jack: impossible. everyone knows you're not allowed to change defaults or customize anything and must judge a system how it comes out of the box
22:49 < Psi-Jack> And that the gnome-3 style apps actually work better in i3.
22:50 < popnfloss> i was a very devout KDE user for a long time but since plasma 5 its just been a bugfest
22:50 < jim> wonderer, still here?
22:50 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: I was a KDE user since KDE pre 1.0.0
22:50 < Psi-Jack> It got floppy with KDE 4, and KDE 5... Well, it never got better. Simply put.
22:50 < popnfloss> yeah
22:50 < Psi-Jack> KDE 3 was the last good versions of KDE.
22:51 < popnfloss> kde 3 was probably the pinnacle of linux desktop environments
22:51 < popnfloss> nothing else has ever been as good as that was
22:51 < dgurney> I wonder how trinity is doing
22:51 < triceratux> popnfloss: lxqt is what kde has been waiting for. kstars installs with only 10 debs. thats a heavy kde app on a lightweight qt based de thats nearly bugfree
22:51 < Psi-Jack> dgurney: Bad enough that nobody talks about it.
22:51 < popnfloss> its doing what it can
22:51 < bls> KDE3 was better than Compiz and its wobbly windows?
22:51 < freqnasty> hi, does anyone know of a way to delay the deactivation of plymouth boot splash, so as to make the splash stay on screen longer?
22:51 < rascul> trinity hasn't released in 1.5 years
22:51 < Psi-Jack> bls: Loads.
22:52 < popnfloss> the problem is its pretty much impossible to port every kde3 app to qt5
22:52 < dgurney> well it seems like they're doing something on their git repos, but meh, I don't really care anyway tbh
22:52 < popnfloss> its not like gnome 2, which the mate team were able to port to gtk3 without too much trouble
22:52 < triceratux> im running trinity on my raspi3b. bought it from the q4os website in fact (before it vanished). support free software
22:52 < Psi-Jack> I hope one day KDE fixes all their issues.
22:53 < popnfloss> qt4 and qt5 are very, very different than qt3 was
22:53 < jim> wonderer, we lost you... oh well... so, next time, it would be good if you could focus on the conversation.... because, at the time, there were folks (at least one folk) waiting for you to respond
22:53 < triceratux> rascul: trinity is complete. doesnt need revisions :)
22:53 < Psi-Jack> qt4 was nice.
22:54 < Psi-Jack> qt5... Is nice..
22:54 < Psi-Jack> KDE 5.... Is horrible.
22:54 < popnfloss> when the kde team wrote kde4 they pretty much had to rewrite everything for qt4
22:54 < popnfloss> and it took years
22:54 < dgurney> I like KDE 5, never really liked 4 tbh
22:54 < popnfloss> i didnt like how 4 looked compared to 5
22:54 < Psi-Jack> 4 was never really stable.
22:54 < Psi-Jack> Ever...
22:54 < snugger> Slackware is still on KDE 4
22:54 < popnfloss> kde 5 looks great, i love the breeze theme
22:54 < popnfloss> the problem is it crashes constantly and all the apps have annoying bugs
22:55 < snugger> I hate flat themes
22:55 < snugger> So lifeless
22:55 < triceratux> fedora 28 lxqt is tolerable. the f26 version was still freezing up with daily usage. that seems to have gone away
22:55 < Psi-Jack> snugger: You would hate i3 then. ;)
22:55 < toothe> Slackware has a special place in my heart.
22:55 < dgurney> I know 5 was terrible at the beginning, but last I properly used it a few versions back (I think 5.10.x), it felt solid to me
22:55 < Psi-Jack> toothe: That black pit part?
22:55 < Psi-Jack> :)
22:55 < popnfloss> and you cant customize the look of kde5 at all
22:55 < toothe> It was the first distro I used.
22:56 < popnfloss> no custom panel color or transparency, no getting rid of that stupid panel shadow
22:56 < toothe> no...it wasn't the first. But it was the first one I became attached to.
22:56 < popnfloss> all you have are a limited selection of user made themes which are, quite frankly, horrible
22:56 < Psi-Jack> toothe: Youngin. :)
22:56 < toothe> ha! How old are you?
22:56 < jim> yeah, slackware was my first -installed- linux...
22:56 < Psi-Jack> toothe: Old enough to have, at least with Linux, started with SLS, but had heard of MCC.
22:56 < jim> after booting sls
22:57 < toothe> SLS?
22:57 < popnfloss> dgurney: well the problem is i run fedora, so i always get the latest version of everything
22:57 < toothe> Soft Landing?
22:57 < popnfloss> which is fine for most things, but not fine for KDE
22:57 < Psi-Jack> SLS is what Slackware was based on, yes.
22:57 < dgurney> popnfloss, I used KDE on Gentoo
22:57 < jim> Soft Landing Systems, iirc
22:57 < dgurney> and probably will again once I build a new desktop
22:57 < toothe> When I was running Linux, my dad thought I was nuts.
22:57 < toothe> now I work in the field and pay for her mortgage.
22:57 < popnfloss> he was right
22:57 < bls> never mucked with SLS, it was yggdrasil for a bit until the Red Hat guys started coming onto campus and handing out CDs
22:57 < jim> came on floppy images, loaded everything into a ramdisk
22:58 < Psi-Jack> Softlanding Linux Systems
22:58 < Psi-Jack> -s
22:58 < karl_gau55> her?
22:58 < toothe> sorry, switched pronouns - its now my mom's mortgage.
22:58 < toothe> dad passed.
22:58 < popnfloss> the first linux i used was knoppix
22:58 < BitShack> Hello
22:58 < toothe> I wish BSD had taken off the way Linux did.
22:58 < triceratux> popnfloss: yer ideally positioned for the f28 lxqt then. its worth a look https://spins.fedoraproject.org/en/lxqt/
22:58 < popnfloss> someone gave me a knoppix cd after i told them i couldnt boot into windows and backup my files
22:58 < bls> why? you can still use BSD
22:58 < toothe> I do.
22:58 < jim> hi
22:58 < zeldafan78> bls: No, you can't.
22:58 < popnfloss> ive looked at lxqt
22:58 < toothe> but, it sucks with hardware.
22:59 < zeldafan78> Not with that "Code of Conduct".
22:59 < popnfloss> it looks promising but its still pretty early in development for my tastes
22:59 < toothe> that's irrelevant.
22:59 < zeldafan78> And not with all that suckitude.
22:59 < dgurney> who cares about CoC, technical merits are what matter
22:59 < popnfloss> i might try it on a virtual machine sometime
22:59 < meyou> SJWs gonna getcha
22:59 < zeldafan78> dgurney: Who cares about licenses too, right?
22:59 < Psi-Jack> dgurney: That's... What she said?
22:59 < zeldafan78> Just a bunch of text in a document, right?
22:59 < toothe> dgurney: precisely.
22:59 < bls> I pick my OS first, my hardware second. have to since most OEMs doen't bother supporting FOSS. don't have any hardware problems
22:59 < zeldafan78> So let's ignore Code of Conducts as well as licenses.
23:00 < dgurney> zeldafan78, licenses matter more to a user than some developer conduct rules
23:00 < bls> zeldafan78: there's more than one BSD
23:00 < toothe> I'm literally anti-liberal to the point where I don't believe in Free Speech - and I love BSD>
23:00 < dgurney> and that
23:00 < popnfloss> you can't ignore licenses
23:00 < snugger> Psi-Jack: I don't avoid tiling window managers because of their looks. I just prefer to use a the trackpoint to do stuff
23:00 < toothe> and find no problem with the CoC.
23:00 < popnfloss> i mean unless you want to get sued
23:00 < jim> zeldafan78, it's a license that has protected your rights for linux all these years
23:00 < Psi-Jack> snugger: Hehe.
23:00 < Psi-Jack> snugger: I like the fact I never have a burried window. :)
23:01 < popnfloss> i dont get the point of tiling window managers
23:01 < Psi-Jack> And that I combine keyboard and mouse way more effectively.
23:01 < popnfloss> i dont want every dialog that pops up to take up half my screen
23:01 < triceratux> toothe: if youre anti-freespeech youre actually pro-liberal these days
23:01 < karl_gau55> Sure but we have the FSF to thank fot that
23:01 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: They don't.
23:01 < bls> popnfloss: they're for people that like to automate their window arragement
23:01 < dgurney> popnfloss, on a smart one, they don't
23:01 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: Dialogs don't pop up in a tile.
23:01 < zeldafan78> How many in here know what the "SAFE" network is?
23:01 < Psi-Jack> Not in a good tiling wm like i3 anyway.
23:01 < popnfloss> and if they are detecting that and making them floating windows then its not exactly a tiling window manager anymore now is it
23:01 < toothe> triceratux: that's a misnomer...but I see your point. I think free speech is over-rated and those who champion free-speech don't really, only when their side is under attack.
23:02 < toothe> triceratux: ie, they're hypocrites.
23:02 < snugger> i3wm is the only tiling wm I can stand
23:02 < popnfloss> it really begs the question, if they think its more convenient to make those windows not tile, then why make any of them tile
23:02 < zeldafan78> toothe: "Free speech" is a ridiculous concept that breaks down the minute you deal with "the masses".
23:02 < popnfloss> why not just use any of the myriad of DEs/window managers that allow you to tile any window you want by dragging it to the edges or corners of the screen
23:02 < dgurney> because it makes sense for other windows, but not for popup ones
23:02 < zeldafan78> "Free speech" only seems semi-reasonable in the company of highly intelligent and nice people.
23:02 < snugger> I know all the keybindings by heart but...I find myself inefficient using them
23:02 < bls> because you don't want to have to drag anything
23:02 < toothe> zeldafan78: or you discuss whether it actually meets its objectives.
23:02 < kidosatori> When I seek to a random position of a file (not EOF), and do an fwrite of one byte, does linux update only one byte or a whole filesystem block?
23:02 < toothe> zeldafan78: concur.
23:03 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: Whould should I make extra effort to even TOUCH my mouse, if I just open an app up and it's tiled?
23:03 < Psi-Jack> And I can use the keyboard to quickly position it in the exact way I want literally 100 times faster.
23:03 < dgurney> for instance, I have no window borders on my i3 setup, which saves me pixels which does matter on a 1366x768 screen
23:03 < popnfloss> i think the real reason people use tiling window managers is so they can have a bunch of terminals open on their screen with a cool bitmap font, with transparency and a space wallpaper behind it, and they feel like a l33t haxor
23:04 < bls> popnfloss has some pent up window manager issues it seems like
23:04 < koala_man> kidosatori: depends on the backing device
23:04 < snugger> dgurney: Not with me. I have that exact resolution and I'm perfectly fine using a non-tiling wm
23:04 < Psi-Jack> I have an IRC client, mutliple IM clients, a SINGLE terminal application, a browser, an email client, and much mroe.
23:04 < karl_gau55> As someone who switched from gnome to i3, tiling wms truly do boost productivity
23:04 < dgurney> snugger, good for you
23:04 < snugger> Not much screenspace wasted when you use themes with very small titlebars
23:04 < dgurney> even less with no title bars :)
23:04 < bls> or no window chrome at all
23:04 < Psi-Jack> snugger: LOTS of space wasted for that crap.
23:05 < karl_gau55> Not to mention all the bloat that comes with desktop environments
23:05 < snugger> Psi-Jack: "Not much screenspace wasted when you use themes with very small titlebars"
23:05 < BitShack> For some reason, after I rebooted my damn small linux machine after first boot and setting up ssh server, it says access denied when I type in my password for the user
23:05 < Psi-Jack> snugger: LOTS of space wasted for that crap.
23:05 < BitShack> Idk of anyone knows how to fix thi
23:05 < popnfloss> i just dont see the point of tiling anything in a tiling window manager besides terminal windows
23:05 < popnfloss> and if thats all you're tiling then you might as well just have one terminal open and use tmux
23:05 < dgurney> it seems like you can't be convinced
23:05 < snugger> Still don't see how that tiny amount of space could make a difference
23:06 < snugger> When it's garbage like Adwaita I can
23:06 < kidosatori> koala_man: Oh, so it's not a linux or ext4/zfs/btrfs/... thing but a hardware-specific thing?
23:06 < popnfloss> and then youll have your "tiling window manager" on top of whatever else you're using
23:06 < bls> I don't want my editor to overlap my browser to overlap my mail client to overlap my terminal, and I also don't want to have to constantly drag and resize things if I happen to open a PDF
23:06 < Psi-Jack> And the fact i3 has seperate virtual workspaces between each display monitor, that alone makes a world of difference.
23:07 < snugger> The default style of Tails is absolutely dreadful. It's the inefficient GNOME2-style 2 panel layout PLUS the gigantic adwaita theme
23:07 < Psi-Jack> Having one massive virtual desktop switcher always effect multiple monitors is inefficient.
23:07 < snugger> I believe CentOS is using that layout by default as well
23:07 < dgurney> edge snapping is a good thing (and I use it all time on DEs and Windows), but you can't beat a proper tiling WM for that
23:07 < snugger> Correct me if I'm wrong
23:07 < uplime> you're wrong
23:07 < Psi-Jack> ^
23:08 < snugger> I thought centos used the 2 panel layout
23:08 < snugger> Hm
23:08 < uplime> i don't actually know
23:08 < koala_man> kidosatori: the hardware is the only thing I know of that strictly forces you to write more. I don't know if the VFS cache always rounds up. The FS you can change out, but any modern FS will update journal and mtime and such too
23:08 < Psi-Jack> CentOS 7 uses MATE
23:08 < bls> I'm using MacOS for work and it's infuriating to have to resize and move windows every day attaching and detaching a monitor
23:08 < uplime> i just like telling people they're wrong
23:08 < snugger> lol
23:08 < uplime> bls: odd. mine doesn't do that
23:08 < Psi-Jack> bls: heh
23:08 < snugger> Psi-Jack: Good for them
23:08 < uplime> my coworkers did but he had windows installed
23:09 < dgurney> bls, macOS default window management sucks, I agree
23:09 < toothe> default? can you change it?
23:09 < Psi-Jack> But yeah, C7  uses the top and bottom panels like Gnome 2 did, jsut using MATE.
23:09 < dgurney> I think so with third party stuff, but I never really looked into it
23:09 < zeldafan78> I've been researching secure hardware lately. I have found that there are only four different companies/groups in the entire world that claim to sell them: Ministry of Freedom, Vikings, Purism and that company that makes the impossible-to-find Talos II-something workstation. Out of those four, three have major issues: Ministry of Freedom is run by a "trans person" who is also behind Libreboot, and trying to fund his "sex change" operation of
23:09 < zeldafan78> £200,000 British pounds, making me highly question the sanity of that company and also Libreboot. Purism allegedly uses a bunch of non-free binary blobs or something (in spite of claiming to sell secure hardware). That Talos II thing is *very* expensive and uses an exotic architecture (IBM POWER9?). Left is basically the Germany-based Vikings, which seem to have a rather obnoxious payment process and, after all, only seem to be selling refurbished
23:09 < zeldafan78>  old IBM/Lenovo laptops with Libreboot or Coreboot (unspecified -- red flag there too...) installed. And even if I do order from them, who knows if they add their own spy stuff or if the package is intercepted on its way here? I would never be able to tell for sure. And then I have an underpowered old laptop. Yay. To run... Linux? Qubes OS is too heavy for that old hardware (and sucks anyways). In short: the availability of "secure" computers is
23:09 < zeldafan78> essentially nonexistent. Please make sure to comment on what you run and how you got your "secure" hardware.
23:10 < bls> there are some hacky third party programs to kind of try to make it work, but they tend to break every new release
23:10 < Psi-Jack> Well, hello wall of text.
23:10 < rascul> oh my
23:10 < snugger> Can someone explain why anybody would use the GNOME2/Mate layout? It just seems like a horrible waste of space
23:10 < snugger> holy
23:10 < mawk> oh your
23:10 < Psi-Jack> Statring of badly with "hardware" ;)
23:10 < mawk> what's wrong about trans zeldafan78 ?
23:10 < mawk> exactly
23:10 < bls> someone forgot their lithium
23:10 < NoriusNotorius> I agree with you guys in regards to MACOS window management. I had to turn in my laptop which was running debian with i3 and now I'm suffering with this window manager. Sooo inefficient.
23:10 < Psi-Jack> !ops zeldafan78 Trolling
23:11 < zeldafan78> Psi-Jack!*@* added to ignore list.
23:11 < zeldafan78> Read what I typed out for you.
23:11 < mawk> I don't think he's trolling
23:11 < Psi-Jack> No
23:11 < mawk> if the only bad thing is the payment process what are you waiting for zeldafan78
23:11 < snugger> mawk: Oh boy
23:11 < zeldafan78> mawk: Not the only one.
23:11 < Psi-Jack> mawk: I skimmed enough to see that he is.
23:11 < dgurney> Windows is much better window-management wise these days, since it has proper snapping (and has had that since 7)
23:11 < Disconsented> Thats a really obvious troll
23:11 < Disconsented> like holy shit
23:11 < dgurney> I think the closest macOS has to snapping by default is that you can have 2 full-screened programs side to side
23:11 < dgurney> but that just sucks
23:11 < zeldafan78> Are you mentally ill? Did you read what I typed at all?
23:12 < jim> okok, what's up?
23:12 < popnfloss> snugger: ive noticed that most people who use mate or xfce dont use the default panel layout, they just remove one panel and have a bottom panel and use the windows layout
23:12 < zeldafan78> I'm seriously asking Linux people if they have found secure hardware to use.
23:12 < popnfloss> youd think the developers would take notice of that
23:12 < Psi-Jack> jim: zeldafan78, wall flooding with very subjective unusual material.
23:12 < snugger> popnfloss: Me too.
23:12 < mawk> audit libreboot if you don't trust them zeldafan78
23:12 < rascul> zeldafan78 you should have just asked that instead of flooding the channel
23:12 < mawk> but the transexuality of its lead dev shouldn't be an issue
23:12 < rascul> i'm not reading your damn wall of text
23:12 < zeldafan78> "Flooding"?
23:12 < mawk> it's been declassified as a mental illness I think
23:12 < jab416171> dgurney, have you tried a tiling WM?
23:12 < jab416171> like i3
23:13 < dgurney> jab416171, I'm using i3 as we speak :P
23:13 < rascul> if you can't fit your question in 1 or 2 lines then the number of responses you'll get start going down quick
23:13 < popnfloss> mawk: stop with the alt-right rants
23:13 < mawk> what are you saying popnfloss
23:13 < koala_man> mawk: how do you audit an Intel chip?
23:13 < snugger> popnfloss: What's wrong with the alt-right?
23:13 < mawk> popnfloss: zeldafan78 was saying something about trans, not me
23:13 < triceratux> zeldafan78: theres no such thing as secure hardware or secure software. thats why i run linux liveisos in memory. the session is ephemeral & theres nothing on the disk persistent enough to target
23:13 < popnfloss> if i want to hear bigots talk about trans people being "mentally ill" then ill go to 4chan
23:13 < mawk> don't mix the two of us
23:13 < Disconsented> and they left
23:13 < mawk> he's the one that said that transexuality means insanity
23:13 < mawk> not me
23:14 < popnfloss> oh well my mistake then
23:14 < triceratux> oops
23:14  * snugger eats popcorn
23:14 < koala_man> what does Stallman use these days?
23:14 < snugger> Trisquel
23:14 < snugger> Last I heard
23:14 < uplime> excuse me
23:14 < triceratux> trisquel ftw. its ubuntu libre
23:14 < uplime> I think you mean gnu + trisquel
23:14 < snugger> I have no idea why though
23:14 < rascul> ubuntu libre? so, debian?
23:14 < popnfloss> he uses an old thinkpad that doesnt have the intel management engine bios
23:15 < snugger> debian includes kernel blobs
23:15 < popnfloss> and some debian fork that contains no non-free software
23:15 < snugger> despite them saying they do not
23:15 < rascul> eh i guess the fsf has a different definition of free than debian does
23:15 < popnfloss> which i dont really get becaues debian itself contains no non-free software or binary blobs that i know of
23:15 < popnfloss> they have a repository for non-free software but its disabled by default
23:15 < snugger> Their reason for not liking Debian is that it has a nonfree repo and it does not have a deblobbed kernel
23:15 < popnfloss> but i guess thats not enough for stallman
23:15 < bls> does trisquel have active anti-non-free software countermeasures? like anti-virus but for proprietary software?
23:15 < triceratux> rascul: https://trisquel.info/
23:15 < popnfloss> i thought debian didnt have blobs in the kernel
23:16 < rascul> triceratux i'm not really that interested in it, it's obviously a junk distro
23:16 < snugger> My wifi card requires proprietary software and it works perfectly on Debian
23:16 < bls> popnfloss: you can add them if you want, so it's considered non-free
23:16 < dgurney> only libre distro I'd consider using is Parabola, and that's because I prefer rolling-release stuff
23:16 < snugger> So does my desktop and it works well
23:16 < snugger> But not on trisquel, guixsd, ect.
23:16 < popnfloss> when i use debian i have to install all the non-free firmware/microcode myself
23:16 < mawk> popnfloss: they also criticize the fact that there are articles on the debian wiki about how to get non-free software
23:16 < kidosatori> koala_man: I see, thank you very much.
23:16 < popnfloss> so i assumed it didnt have any blobs
23:16 < snugger> popnfloss: Very odd
23:16 < mawk> and also that the non-free repo is hosted on debian servers themselves
23:16 < snugger> They claim not to
23:17 < bls> popnfloss: to be truely free, it has to actively prevent you from doing so
23:17 < rascul> if only fsf would just make their own kernel...
23:17 < snugger> rascul: They do
23:17 < popnfloss> if you're running the debian derivative stallman uses, you can just as easily enable those same non-free repositories
23:17 < snugger> linux-libre
23:17 < Psi-Jack> https://www.gnu.org/distros/common-distros.en.html
23:18 < Psi-Jack> Heh
23:18 < Psi-Jack> I laugh at this.
23:18 < jim> actually, he was telling us his research history... that way, we wouldn't have to repeat it... he was trying to find something, and asking for help.
23:18 < rascul> snugger no, they disn't make that, the actual reference would be hurd
23:18 < popnfloss> i like to think that stallman secretely uses windows 10
23:18 < popnfloss> running on a macbook pro
23:18 < snugger> rascul: They develop it though
23:18 < karl_gau55> Can you imagine stalman interacting with cortana
23:18 < rascul> snugger i mean they didn't make it in the sense that it's just a patched linux kernel, not something original
23:18 < koala_man> kidosatori: btw fwrite will buffer when you just write single bytes, this assumes that you close/flush
23:18 < triceratux> trisquel 8.0: http://pastebin.centos.org/746201/raw/
23:19 < popnfloss> i dont think stallman even uses a web browser
23:19 < popnfloss> he has some script he set up that curls webpages and emails them to himself lol
23:19 < karl_gau55> he uses the one built into emacs
23:19 < popnfloss> ive talked to him before, he responds to every single email he gets
23:19 < popnfloss> hes like the john peel of email
23:19 < rascul> https://stallman.org/stallman-computing.html
23:20 < snugger> I would think a guy like Stallman would use something that is more minimal than Trisquel
23:20 < snugger> Don't know why
23:20 < snugger> But he seems like that type of guy
23:20 < triceratux> rascul: thats the one. after all these years rms winds up running a buntu rofl
23:20 < bls> jim: yes, but he kept mixing in non-linux related, controvesial topics with his absolutist opinions on them in the middle of everything he says. if he could leave those out, no one would have an issue
23:20 < rascul> https://rms.sexy
23:20 < popnfloss> i was starting a school textbook public torrent tracker and told him about it and he was all psyched about it
23:21 < Psi-Jack> bls: And never really defined what "secure hardware" actually is. :)
23:21 < popnfloss> i ended up abandoning it though
23:21 < popnfloss> i was doing it because a college course i was taking required me to buy a book on kindle
23:21 < snugger> poor little haikuOS is condemned by the FSF
23:21 < popnfloss> and i rented it, removed the DRM, and released it on bittorrent so nobody else would have to do that
23:22 < dgurney> popnfloss, nice!
23:22 < popnfloss> and i did that to all the other books that i couldnt find free copies of
23:22 < popnfloss> the companies who sell school textbooks are awful criminals
23:23 < dgurney> that is a very kind thing to do, but I can see that becoming overwhelming both financially and time-wise
23:23 < snugger> popnfloss: Say what
23:23 < dgurney> which is probably why you abandoned lol
23:23 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: ... So, piracy is strong with this one. Sad to hear.
23:23 < popnfloss> they just rearrange the pages and the exercise questions with each new edition, to force everyone to pay $200 for a brand new copy
23:23 < koala_man> haha, Microsoft is finally adding Unix line ending support to Notepad
23:23 < dgurney> I have very little sympathy for school textbook writers
23:24 < dgurney> or well, publishers
23:24 < dgurney> I'm sure if it was up to the writers the books wouldn't cost an arm and leg
23:24 < popnfloss> Psi-Jack: school textbooks are extremely overpriced and students have a hard enough time as it is paying for their education, with constant tuition hikes
23:24 < bls> wow, no more /bin/bash no such file or directory?
23:24 < snugger> I don't see anything wrong with SOME proprietary softwae. (Such as game roms) Some developers just don't want people to directly copy their code and make money off it
23:24 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: They are, definitely. I don't disagree with that. But piracy only makes the prices go up, not down.
23:24 < popnfloss> distributing free textbooks is a very noble and important public service
23:24 < bls> popnfloss: it's not on topic and piracy discussions are forbidden in here
23:25 < koala_man> bls: it'll still default to CRLF so no. But at least now you can view a file and have it not look like trash
23:25 < meyou> complain to the teachers setting course requirements getting kickbacks from publishers
23:25 < popnfloss> well the teachers arent exactly rolling in the dough either
23:25 < popnfloss> they get paid shit
23:25 < bls> ah, so just a minor improvement
23:25 < ayecee> mind the language please
23:25 < popnfloss> so i dont fault them too much for that
23:26 < buffalodp> a new system can fix the USA
23:26 < buffalodp> it's called linux
23:26 < popnfloss> its called socialism :)
23:26 < ayecee> we can take all the old problems and replace them with new problems!
23:26 < popnfloss> but dont wait for that to happen
23:26 < dgurney> I kind of feel bad for teachers in USA (at least based on what I've heard)
23:26 < Psi-Jack> Now we're REAAAAALLY off base here.
23:26 < buffalodp> with over 8000 developers
23:26 < buffalodp> world peace is possible
23:26 < snugger> dgurney: We must arm them with firearms
23:26 < ayecee> we must arm them with bear arms
23:26 < dgurney> oh deary me, where is this going
23:26 < ayecee> it's in the constitution
23:27 < popnfloss> yeah lets not pay the teachers a decent salary
23:27 < jim> popnfloss, are you aware of MIT's opencourseware? ocw.mit.edu
23:27 < popnfloss> instead lets give them all pistols, so they can shoot and kill their students
23:27 < popnfloss> america
23:27 < bls> dgurney: some people have found an audience for their off-topic rants
23:27 < popnfloss> greatest country in the world
23:27 < ayecee> popnfloss: please to stop politicking
23:27 < snugger> popnfloss: They wouldn't do that
23:27 < Psi-Jack> ^ aGREED.
23:27 < meyou> replace the government with systemd
23:27 < meyou> >:)
23:27 < popnfloss> well thats what theyre for
23:27 < Psi-Jack> ^ With ayece's statement. :)
23:27 < snugger> The government is already cancerous
23:27 < ayecee> popnfloss: it gets people riled up and it's offtopic. a bad combination.
23:27 < Dagmar> Well, then let'
23:28 < buffalodp> replace health insurance with linux
23:28 < srverroom> anyone out here running Manjaro?
23:28 < Dagmar> s hope that the next time some dimwit comes to class with a rifle and starts shooting hte place up, a teacher can stop them.  ...and while we're at it let's hope stupid people stop saying stupid things about this all the bloody time.
23:28 < Psi-Jack> srverroom: Manjaro is no good.
23:28 < mutante> systemctl mask gov --filibuster
23:28 < srverroom> psi-jack:why?
23:28 < popnfloss> god, is there anywhere i can go on the internet to escape from the alt-right
23:28 < popnfloss> theyre everywhere
23:28 < dgurney> I think instead of using Manjaro, you should use vanilla Arch
23:29 < snugger> popnfloss: The alt-right isn't harmful
23:29 < popnfloss> its just rampant stupidity
23:29 < snugger> Why are you against them
23:29 < Dagmar> popnfloss: It's the /quit command.  Feel free to use it.
23:29 < CoJaBo> this is ##linux bro
23:29 < popnfloss> by paranoid racist morons
23:29 < snugger> Nobody here probably identifies as a member of the alt-right
23:29 < snugger> Just stop talking about it
23:29 < popnfloss> go to /pol/ to talk about that stuff
23:29 < snugger> Cripes
23:29 < Psi-Jack> srverroom: /msg phrik !manjaro, then !manjaro1, then !manjaro2, Keep going.,..
23:29 < popnfloss> this isnt 4chan
23:29 < ayecee> !ops popnfloss can't stop politicking
23:29 < snugger> No crap
23:29 < bls> calling someone alt-right / a SJW is the new Godwin's Law and you're incapble of staying on topic
23:30 < srverroom> Psi-Jack: I don't follow
23:30 < snugger> !ops popnfloss targetting an entire group of people racist and politicking
23:30 < buffalodp> anyone running open hardware?
23:30 < popnfloss> snugger: one person just said trans people are mentally ill, and now another person is saying we need guns in schools
23:30 < ayecee> snugger: probably should only be doing it once.
23:30 < Dagmar> I keep my hardware closed up so the air will flow through it properly
23:30 < popnfloss> snugger: and lets not forget about sauvin
23:30 < mutante> alt-linux hangs out on #debian-offtopic
23:30 < popnfloss> the op making racist comments
23:30 < Psi-Jack> srverroom: prhik is #archlinux's channel bot, !manjaro is a keyword, !manjaro1 is another keyboard, there's like 20~100 of them for manjaro.
23:30 < buffalodp> what's alt-linux?
23:31 < karl_gau55> bsd
23:31 < d1z> guys I gotta take this command "set -o pipefail; hdfs dfs -cat {source}/{hdfs_processing_dir}/{original_name} | gzip -c | ssh -o StrictHostKeyChecking=no -o UserKnownHostsFile=/dev/null -i /golang/applications/dav_uploader/dav_uploader.key user@1.1.1.1 'cat > {destination}/{original_name}.gz'" and I need to insert right after the first cat, an IF statement that will redirect the output of that cat to the
23:31 < d1z> following awk command if original_name contains the word "XWORD": "awk -F";" '{print $10,$9,$120,$2,$5,$6,$8,$86,$19,$12,$115}'  OFS=";" {original_name}"... or execute the following if original_name contains "YWORD": "awk -F";" '{print $1,$2,$5,$6,$7,$11,$17,$19,$57,$68,$72}'  OFS=";" {original_name}"
23:31 < ayecee> tl;dr
23:31 < d1z> how can I insert that if into the first one liner?
23:31 < popnfloss> lol
23:31 < Dagmar> d1z: Look at the man page for awk and you will find if statements explained pretty early on
23:32 < Psi-Jack> Oh, sorry there's no !manjaro1, but !manjaro, !manjaro2, ...
23:32 < popnfloss> cant tell if thats a troll or not
23:32 < snugger> Let's divert our attention from politics. Let's have a friendly discussion on GNOME, systemd and why we dislike certain distros
23:33 < snugger> :D
23:33 < dgurney> snugger, so just switch to different politics?
23:33 < NerdTheThird> gnome sucks
23:33 < popnfloss> ubuntu is the worst thing that has ever happened to linux
23:33 < popnfloss> thoughts?
23:33 < srverroom> are you saying I can't discuss that distro in here?
23:33 < snugger> everything sucks and you should feel bad for using it
23:33 < snugger> tl;dr'd
23:33 < triceratux> ubuntu isnt evil, but systemd-resolved is
23:33 < ayecee> nice
23:33 < popnfloss> people give richard stallman a hard time and say hes crazy and all that, but he made a good point about ubuntu and its spyware
23:34 < NerdTheThird> why would anyone use gnome is beyond me
23:34 < karl_gau55> Maybe, but it also made linux available to normies
23:34 < Psi-Jack> srverroom: Nope. Not saying that. but you might get better help in #manjaro, their own dedicated (and very idle, lacking in knowledge) channel.
23:34 < Dagmar> triceratux: It's a problem looking for something it can be a solution to
23:34 < popnfloss> like even though theyve gotten rid of it after people complained, theyve broken a core tenant of the FOSS philosophy and destroyed their credibility
23:34 < dgurney> [everything I don't like] sucks, and I don't care about what your reasons for liking are, you are absolute cancer if you like [everything I don't like]!
23:34 < dgurney> just kidding obviously, I really don't care
23:35 < srverroom> I wasn't looking for help, just curious about who is using what. seems like a lot of trash talk more than anything in here...
23:35 < popnfloss> the entire reason people run linux is they want to be in control of their computer and not be a slave to corporate business interests, they dont want to be spied on, they dont want to be advertised to
23:35 < dgurney> srverroom, welcome to any linux community
23:35 < popnfloss> and ubuntu went completely against that
23:35 < snugger> Anybody here use alpine?
23:35 < Psi-Jack> popnfloss: I do not run Linux for ANY of those reasons.
23:35 < meyou> popnfloss, i mean, for some people i guess
23:35 < srverroom> lol
23:35 < triceratux> srverroom: noone in here used mint when it was #1. that will probably carry over to manjaro ;)
23:35 < buffalodp> a long time ago snugger
23:35 < popnfloss> meyou: well thats the only real reason to use it
23:35 < srukle> Linux is not a political movement.
23:35 < dgurney> I use linux because I happen to like the way it works
23:36 < snugger> srukle: many people would have you believe that
23:36 < Psi-Jack> dgurney++
23:36 < ayecee> srukle: you're just not linuxing hard enough then
23:36 < beshoo> how can i instal libgearman-devel  on my centos7
23:36 < beshoo> since yum can not find it
23:36 < srverroom> triceratux: how do you mean?
23:36 < Dagmar> beshoo: Did you enable EPEL repos?
23:36 < snugger> CentOS uses dnf isn't it?
23:36 < popnfloss> windows and macos are more convenient and compatible with more software, but the tradeoff is a big company is telling you what you can and cant do with them and they are using them to spy on you and sell things to you
23:36 < snugger> doesn't*
23:36 < Dagmar> beshoo: It's probably in those somewhere
23:36 < Psi-Jack> snugger: No
23:36 < beshoo> No package libgearman-devel available.
23:36 < srukle> ayecee: hm you're right. i should write a blog
23:36 < popnfloss> snugger: its still using yum
23:36 < Dagmar> beshoo: Search for just libgearman without the devel part
23:37 < snugger> eugh
23:37 < beshoo> i found it
23:37 < dgurney> popnfloss, hmmm... where have I heard this before
23:37 < snugger> poor CentOS users
23:37 < beshoo> but i need the lib
23:37 < beshoo> oh
23:37 < karl_gau55> Ubuntu is a gateway drug into linux, a transition from macos/win10
23:37 < beshoo> let see
23:37 < Loshki> I'd expect it to be called libgearman-dev anyway
23:37 < Psi-Jack> Loshki: -dev is a Debian thing.
23:37 < popnfloss> karl_gau55: thats the problem with ubuntu
23:37 < Psi-Jack> -devel is a RHEL thing
23:37 < beshoo> No package libgearman available.
23:37 < Dagmar> still, it's EPEL so practically anything goes sometimes
23:37 < popnfloss> it has this reputation as being the beginners distro to introduce people to linux
23:37 < popnfloss> thats why they pulled that crap with amazon
23:37 < Dagmar> beshoo: No, use `yum search` to actually search
23:38 < popnfloss> because they view their users as a bunch of newbie idiots who wouldnt know any better
23:38 < Loshki> Psi-Jack: I didn't know that, thanks
23:38 < Psi-Jack> Loshki: Hehe
23:38 < popnfloss> so why would anyone ever want to support them and use their crappy os
23:38 < Psi-Jack> Loshki: It's annoying sometimes, but meh. :)
23:38 < beshoo> No matches found
23:38 < beshoo> yum search libgearman
23:38 < popnfloss> and its not any easier or user friendly than fedora or opensuse are
23:38 < dgurney> Ubuntu is still a good introduction to the world of linux, regardless of an amazon button (searches don't go to amazon by default anymore)
23:38 < Psi-Jack> beshoo: Do you know what gearman actually is?
23:38 < triceratux> srverroom: mint is viewed as a more broken version of a broken derivative of debian. manjaro is viewed as a more broken version of arch. thats what pushes projects like that to the top of distrowatch
23:39 < popnfloss> the only difference is it includes non-free codecs by default so you don't have to do a quick google search to find out why your videos wont play
23:39 < beshoo> Psi-Jack YEs
23:39 < Psi-Jack> beshoo: Are you sure? ;)
23:39 < beshoo> SURE
23:39 < srverroom> triceratux what do you run?
23:39 < beshoo> it is to run scripts in background in  parallel
23:40 < beshoo> i am using it on my old box
23:40 < karl_gau55> popnfloss sure but made the linux community more accessible to people just getting into it. Would you rather a macos user jump into Gentoo?
23:40 < beshoo> but now i can not install it on a new server
23:40 < Psi-Jack> beshoo: Hmmm, not exactly.
23:40 < Loshki> I've been on Ubuntu forever, but never used any of their desktops, and certainly not their dreadul spyware DE
23:40 < popnfloss> well you're making kind of an exaggerated argument there
23:40 < Psi-Jack> https://paste.linux-help.org/view/d7ade8f7
23:41 < popnfloss> by comparing it with the most notoriously inconvenient distribution there is
23:41 < dgurney> popnfloss, your arguments aren't that great either
23:41 < toothe> the only thing I dislike so far about Gnome is that to change windows I have to click the "Activities" button.
23:41 < Psi-Jack> That's pretty straightforward though....
23:41 < toothe> which is a little annoying.
23:41 < beshoo> i insalled it but i need Installing PHP Pecl "gearman"
23:41 < Psi-Jack> libgearman, libgearman-devel, gearmand...
23:41 < toothe> Is there a way to have the list of windows in the bar?
23:41 < popnfloss> as opposed to something like fedora or opensuse or manjaro which are, like ubuntu, ready to use out of the box
23:41 < triceratux> srverroom: right now im on LXQtExTiX http://www.extix.se/?p=393 theres nothing special about a fully configured debian / ubuntu with all the codecs & media players & a current kernel
23:41 < beshoo> waht is your YUM REP
23:42 < popnfloss> toothe: get dash to panel or dash to dock
23:42 < popnfloss> toothe: gnome is useless without one of those
23:42 < Psi-Jack> beshoo: you can see that on the paste as well...
23:43 < popnfloss> use dash to panel if you want a windows type interface, use dash to dock if you want it to be like unity and have pinned apps on a sidebar
23:43 < Psi-Jack> gearman stuff comes specifically from EPEL repo though.
23:43 < popnfloss> this is an unpopular statement but, as much as i dislike ubuntu, i actually thought unity wasnt a bad DE
23:43 < popnfloss> and dare to say it was better than gnome 3
23:43  * ayecee gets the pitchforks
23:43 < popnfloss> thats probably why ubuntu got rid of it
23:43 < snugger> I notice most reviewers on distrowatch for Devuan are using either testing or unstable. I don't blame them
23:43 < popnfloss> it was too good of an idea
23:43  * Psi-Jack gets out flame tanks.
23:43 < blip99> hi all. I can get the date/time that packages were installed from dpkg.log, but how can I use that info to find out when I upgraded my ubuntu system? (to 18.04).  IS there something specific to look for
23:43 < snugger> Devuan stable is so old Xfce is out of date
23:43 < uplime> popnfloss: get out
23:44 < popnfloss> every decision they make is terrible
23:44 < popnfloss> unity was a fluke
23:44 < badsekter> popnfloss: is unity dead?
23:44 < popnfloss> yeah, pretty much
23:44 < badsekter> shame
23:44 < popnfloss> its been abandoned as of ubuntu 17.10
23:44 < Psi-Jack> Finally. LOl
23:45 < popnfloss> and i doubt anyone is interested in forking it
23:45 < snugger> They already have
23:45 < popnfloss> they have?
23:45 < snugger> Unity8 is already forked
23:45 < Psi-Jack> More people hated Unity than pretty much every other DE out there.
23:45 < snugger> And working on 18.04
23:45 < triceratux> the fork is being maintained in a repo somewhere
23:45 < popnfloss> i dont know how much unity is tied into ubuntu
23:45 < mutante> then why did they all install Ubuntu.../me shakes head
23:45 < snugger> And it actually looks pretty nice. Uses only 500mb of memory too
23:45 < snugger> lol... "only"
23:45 < popnfloss> and how it can be used on other distros
23:45 < popnfloss> i dont know if it even can
23:46 < srverroom> triceratux what's the upside of this verses manjaro? I'm using it as a daily driver and I use Kali professionaly. I do some customization but I have no interest in building out everything
23:48 < Loshki> Unity is not at all tied into ubuntu. You can add/remove it like pretty much any other DE. Apart from being s ahitty UI, wasn't there some scandal about spyware in the Unity search bar being linked to Amazon ads?
23:49 < triceratux> srverroom: im a fan of liveiso sessions so im quite taken these days with extix lxqt, the altlinux xfce weeklies, & the swagarch monthlies. i dont have to run their installers. & i prefer a standard base without a lot of malintentioned customisation so the bugs are easy to research & fix
23:49 < triceratux> srverroom: so ive never needed to get too far with manjaro & i can generally find something more usable than kali
23:50 < srverroom> so like persistent live boot?
23:50 < srverroom> triceratux^
23:50 < triceratux> srverroom: yep. its one of the things linux does best
23:51 < srverroom> triceratux: I have to admit I really do like that --- just getting Kali set up that way and running around with a customized OS on a USB is fun. what do you do for your backup/redundancy?
23:51 < beshoo> Psi-Jack Thank you , i managed to install it by your kindly advice
23:54 < triceratux> srverroom: ive got a boottime script for each iso that restores a ${HOME} directory & enables squashfs images of installed packages. its based conceptually on what porteus has done with the linux live scripts. its not that uncommon an approach these days actually. theres versions of it in distros from grml to gobolinux
23:57 < srverroom> triceratux not familiar with squashfs, quit google looks like compresses when not active?
23:57 < triceratux> srverroom: the biggest issue with manjaro is that diehard archlinux types have no respect for it so you cant ask them for help. noones heard of swagarch tho so you can sometimes bounce stuff off them if youre careful https://swagarch.github.io/
23:57 < Loshki> blip99: just using dpkg alone might be difficult, but you'd be looking for a sequence of many consecutive installs. There should be copious upgrade logs. If they don't have what you need, at least you';; be able to use the timestamp to know where to look in dpkg
23:58 < triceratux> srverroom: its mountable compressed filesystem images. most live distros use it these days as the third part of their boot after the kernel / initrd
--- Log closed Wed May 09 00:00:08 2018